79 comments

  1. John Konop says:

    Clint,

    I have known you for years, and always respected you, agree or not on issues. I am sure anyone who has ever interacted with you can tell you are a good person. This took real guts for you to speak out. We need more like you from both parties ie integrity first!

  2. Scott65 says:

    He even threw Karen Handel under the bus for saying what people want to hear rather than what she really thinks. That took guts as well. Its time that politicians tell people what they are really for instead of ginning up the rhetoric and falsehoods that pander to the base. We’d be in a much better world if they did.

  3. Three Jack says:

    Clint personifies much of what has caused the GOP to run off so many formerly loyal supporters. ‘What is the government gonna do for me’ has become the mantra for too many so-called responsible conservatives whether it be geezers demanding their mediXXXX or younger folks who suddenly realize we are not guaranteed health and a long life. Obama/RobertsCare is the result of the GOP’s failure to lead when they held the majority… ironic to see someone like Clint who purportedly was a part of that majority putting himself above the principles he used to espouse.

    Life ain’t fair folks and healthcare is not a right.

  4. Three Jack says:

    While some selfishly demand that they be cared for at the expense of others, here is what happens to the others who are forced to pay for the care — letter from Delta Air Lines VP of HR — http://www.scribd.com/doc/162087923/Delta-Airlines-expects-Obamacare-will-directly-and-indirectly-cost-it-100-million-in-2014

    UPS drops ‘white collar’ spousal coverage for 15,000 employees – http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/22/business/ups-to-end-health-benefits-for-spouses-of-some-workers.html?_r=0

    These are just the first examples of many soon to be published stories about the plight of workers being dropped from coverage because of increased cost due to ObamaRobertsCare. Hey but at least we took care of the pre-existers and stay-at-home 26 year old ‘kids’.

    • What chutzpah! First you Republicans spend 20 years talking about how you want healthcare spending to be removed from corporate compensation so that consumers can be more directly involved with healthcare costs. Then when it actually starts to happen, even though it’s something YOU want to happen, you switch your old position because you think you’ll benefit politically.

      Tell me – if I’m employed by a different company and married to someone who works for UPS – why should UPS provide a healthcare benefit to me instead of my company providing it as part of my compensation. I actually agree with you Republicans, it would be ideal if people just bought healthcare coverage on an exchange, and got extra cash compensation from their company instead of an in-kind benefit that they aren’t able to value properly. Decisions like UPS’s are moving us closer to what you guys wanted all along. And now you’re against it because Obama might get some of the credit?

      • Three Jack says:

        First Chris, I’m not part of ‘you Republicans’ so pretty much all of the rest of your rant against ‘you Republicans’ is misguided at best.

        The point I was making with the links shows that due to Obamacare, major companies are being forced to drop coverage to offset additional cost. Much of that additional cost is caused by covering pre-existing conditions (like Clint’s anxiety attacks…), lazy ‘kids’ living at home until they are 26 and so on. I don’t recall any Republicans advocating higher cost to force companies into dropping coverage so that government run exchanges will be the only place for those w/o coverage to find insurance.

        • seenbetrdayz says:

          Don’t forget all the companies who are slashing hours to make sure they stay under the limit for providing coverage.

          Obamacare is a double-whammy. It’s gonna jack up insurance prices AND destroy the jobs people need to pay for that insurance.

  5. gcp says:

    Says he was denied by two insurance companies. Very curious to know who denied him. He needs to check around a little more. Kaiser will take you with pre-existing conditions and they also do conversion policies. Also does his weight contribute to the sleep apnea? Not sure how anxiety medication figures in his situation. Did he utilize COBRA when he left employment? Problem with these stories is that we never get the specifics. Sounds like this guy may be just waiting until Oct. 1 so he can get taxpayer subsidized health care rather than pay for his own care.

    • John Konop says:

      GCP,

      Seriously? The current system you support allows people to have tax payers pay for the healthcare if they do not have health insurance or die…..Clint wants to pay and you insult him? God help you!

      • mpierce says:

        1. Clint wants others to pay for his care.
        2. How are gcp’s questions not legitimate?
        3. Opposing Obamacare is not the same as supporting the current system.

        • Maybe in the fantasy world you live in opposing Obamacare is not the same as supporting the current system. In my world, I count about 40+ repeal bills coming to the floor, and 0 replace bills.

          Sorry, but if you oppose Obamacare, then functionally you support the current/former system. See also, 2001-2007 when Republicans had the House, the White House and for the majority of the time the Senate. They did nothing to change the current system. In practice, that’s what they support and stand up for.

          And and please don’t bother linking me to Tom Price’s bill. That will never get a vote in a million years. It is light years more radical than Obamacare.

      • Three Jack says:

        “The current system you support allows people to have tax payers pay for the healthcare if they do not have health insurance or die.”

        Hilarious again John!

          • Three Jack says:

            Especially the people paying higher premiums to cover all the BS included in your form of healthcare.

              • Three Jack says:

                Are you asking if it cost more?

                Let’s see, insurance companies in collaboration with the Obama gang passed a law that REQUIRES every person to have health coverage including those with pre-existing conditions or else be tracked and penalized by the IRS (they are hiring more bureaucrats to do the penalizing). So we have big insurance partnering with big government and you think consumers will pay less? Again John, you are right on the verge of being qualified for Tuesday amateur night at the Punch Line!

                  • Three Jack says:

                    I understand just fine and have no problem being against what you support. In this case, big insurance/big pharma worked with big government to make sure everybody will be forced to buy their product no matter cost. Mine just went up 40% with considerably higher deductible and out of pocket max in spite of the company joining a multi-million person buying pool. That is a fact John, no BS….cost skyrocketed, coverage declined as a result of the inevitable implementation of Obama/RobertsCare.

                    • Three Jack says:

                      Again John, I understand perfectly having just gone through my open enrollment period….cost way up, service way down. Beyond that simple fact, nobody really knows what will happen if/when this thing is fully implemented except cost will rise.

      • seenbetrdayz says:

        The system YOU support will have people searching far and wide to get enough part-time jobs to be able to pay for insurance cost increases so they can go to see a doctor who hasn’t retired early due to Obamacare, and politicians who supported all of that will get re-elected thanks to generous contributions by a select few monopolistic insurance giants who paid to have all sorts of bells, whistles, and special favors inserted into a multi-thousand page bill which no one read before passing. And if you don’t like it, 16,000 new IRS agents will bust down your door to make sure you’re complying.

        That’s what YOU support, John.

        • John Konop says:

          You know that is not true…..I have posted several suggestions……I am first to say that Obamacare needs help……The difference is I am for solving the problem…..Nothing we do we will be a 100%, but even with the fixes needed it is better than what we have now. We can either improve the system…..or put our heads in the sand…..

    • John Walraven says:

      @GCP:

      I was denied by nine health plans, including Kaiser, due to my diagnosis of sleep apnea. I was diagnosed and recommended for and had surgery & use CPAP to stop waking up (defined as no REM) 31 times per hour. I was losing over 10% of the oxygen I was supposed to absorb during a normal night’s sleep. I snored to the extent that my family was concerned, roommates over the years weren’t sleeping and a security guard came to the door of the Pittsburgh Doubletree after complaints from both “neighbors” about the noise.

      In exchange for taking care of myself, greatly improving my health and reducing risks for other medical problems, I was denied coverage after leaving my job that had a health insurance benefit. I aggressively shopped the market for a plan but was denied every time due to this “pre existing condition”. Again, nine times denied. A conservative estimate would likely be about 40-45 hours of total time filling out forms, having phone interviews, finding physicians to sign papers, etc. The clever part for the plans was they would require our bank account and routing numbers so when they rejected me and accepted my wife and son, they could start tapping that account. That was an additional bureaucratic challenge–to stop several plans from billing me simultaneously.

      I appealed more than half of them and all were denied. ACA requires that you show that you were only denied by one plan. This was the first time in my life that the free market did not provide a service or product that I was ready and willing to buy.

      I’m not getting into the morass of the political or policy discussion of what would “replace” the ACA and it’s requirement that plans actually accept, regardless of premium cost (I’m not looking for the taxpayers to bail me out) folks like me. But the idea that no licensed plan in Georgia would accept an applicant that has taken steps to greatly improved their health, maintain treatment and have objective medical tests to prove it tells me that there is a problem. Whatever your viewpoint on the level of government involvement/intrusion into the delivery of health care in the U.S., when the free market can’t provide a lawful product or a service that a willing buyer is ready and able to purchase, something needs fixing. A husband and father in his 30’s (at least for a few more months :)) needs health coverage in the U.S. My family can’t afford to be one illness away from bankruptcy and I can’t be irresponsible to the extent that I was leave them exposed to that possibility.

      • benevolus says:

        On a side note; I used one of those CPAP units for a while and then on a whim decided to try Breathe Right strips at night. Amazing! No more CPAP.

      • gcp says:

        Mr. Walraven,
        Several issues here. Don’t know about your condition but many health problems are caused by unhealthy behavior, whether its obesity, smoking, alcohol…..Yes it’s an old argument but still true; take care of yourself and you can avoid many illnesses. The idea behind health insurance is that you are insured prior to illness and not having to search for insurance after illness. Unfortunately many chose to carry employer insurance and don’t plan for what happens once they leave employment. Others can afford insurance but would rather buy lotto tickets, new phones, expensive cable…Don’t know when you were refused by Kaiser but they are currently amenable to pre-existing conditions. Also COBRA has been available for many years.

        • John Konop says:

          COBRA is only a temporary coverage. As far as people not buying insurance, I have heard many young professionals say they are taking the risk by not buying the insurance. I have heard the statement here many times on the blog, and once when I spoke in front of the YGOP group in Atlanta. The truth is tax payers and people who buy insurance are taking the risk for them…..Taking the risk means no cash, no service if you need help.

          A GOP candidate for U.S congress bragged on this blog, how he did not have insurance, and thought the discounted deal he negotiated with very favorable terms was not somehow subsidized when he had his healthcare emergency treated at a county hospital.

          At the end day you realize seniors are subsidized a great deal with Medicare? The real issue is how we design a system that we can all afford….When people understand the details a vast majority do not want to let people just get sicker and or die if they do not have the money. If that is true than we need both parties negotiating a long term fix…..

          The crazy part is the old system is so bad, that with even the numerous fixes needed in Obamacare, the old system is way more expensive and does less on a macro for most people.

          • gcp says:

            Mr. Konop

            Of course COBRA is a temporary bridge-type program but some insurance companies do offer conversion policies so you can go straight from one policy to another without using COBRA.

            Taxpayer subsidized exchanges will encourage folks to wait until they have an ongoing or serious condition before they enroll. The penalty for individual insurance avoidance is small and given government inefficiency and taxpayer fraud will often go uncollected. My understanding is risk assessment, except for age, will be mostly eliminated in the exchanges and eventually risk will be eliminated in all policies. Don’t know if the final details have been worked out but if so, you may have an obese 40 smoker paying the same rate as a fit 40 year old and strangely the unhealthy lifestyle may get subsidized. Will that encourage healthy behavior? Of course not. It will only create an expensive mess.

            And remember the temp program which was supposed to be in effect until the exchanges opened? Well it closed early because it ran out of money. As for Medicare, I would change it entirely and go to something closer to the original Ryan plan where seniors go directly to insurance companies rather than the current government reimbursement mess which only encourages fraud.

              • seenbetrdayz says:

                Well, you could say a $700 fine for not having insurance doesn’t quite make it mandatory.

                Personally, I’m just waiting for people to start being arrested or maybe even summarily executed for not having insurance. Then we’d know that the government is truly serious about making sure people get good care.

        • John Walraven says:

          @GCP:

          I appreciate your thoughts but do think you should know that sleep apnea is not an “illness,” in my case, that I could have avoided. Having surgery and using CPAP is, according to your suggestion, “taking care of myself” in order to, as you say, “avoid many illnesses,” mainly heart and lung issues that can occur without treating the condition.

          I was insured prior to the treatment, as mentioned, through a health plan by my former employer. I did plan for what would happen after I left the job. I exhausted 18 months of COBRA and spent much of that time searching for a health plan. The first I applied to was the company that I was covered by for the several previous years who I thought delivered top-notch customer service with a more than adequate physician network. They were the first to reject me.

          In short, if you’re implying that my efforts in maintaining my good health or failure to plan for the future are in any way the cause of nine health plans rejecting my applications for coverage, that implication is baseless. There are people in this country that want to pay for coverage that can’t find it. Some of them don’t smoke, aren’t obese, are planning for their own protection and that of their families well in advance of being uncovered and aren’t lined up at the QT blowing money on lottery, a phone or cable.

        • Dave Bearse says:

          “Unfortunately many chose to carry employer insurance and don’t plan for what happens once they leave employment.”

          Yes, those in good health should forgo the employer-paid health insurance worth thousands to lock in to their own lifetime policy (hoping the company doesn’t ever withdraw from the industry) because the “free market” will never let them leave if a condition develops the would preclude changing insurance. It makes perfect sense.

          “Don’t know when you were refused by Kaiser but they are currently amenable to pre-existing conditions.”

          Indeed the free market was planning to reverse its decades long trend all on its own without the ACA.

    • I remember when the left starting circulating this clip. Two guys yell “yeah” and it suddenly becomes “the crowd yells let him die.” A bit of an exaggeration there Dave.

        • Yeah I mean, when Ron Paul says that’s what freedom is all about, taking the risks, the whole crowd cheers. That’s basically what he’s saying. Charity hospitals for the poor after that blah blah blah, that worked so well we created Medicare/Medicaid, as in – it did not work well.

      • John Konop says:

        Buzz,

        We are friends, and have known each other for a long time. Like Clint, Chris……we have debated many issues over the years……but never have we crossed the line…….it is way over the line anyone implying our friend Clint is a free loader because the system does not allow him reasonable solution for preexisting conditions….

        We can all disagree on solutions, but attacking a cancer survivor and friend this way turns my stomach. Just my 10 cents…..

        • John,

          Never, not once, have I attacked Clint, and I do still consider him a friend.

          Did you watch the video Dave linked to? Clearly that was what I was responding to.

          • John Konop says:

            Buzz,

            Never said you did, sorry if you took it that way. I was talking about the numerous other comments on this thread and others on the blog about Clint. Disagreeing is fine, but some of the comments about Clint go way over the line……Not saying you should take them down, because the more they post the more it shows their heart……

  6. Ghost of William F Buckley says:

    Clint represents what will be a growing number of the GOP faithful that have simply tired of establishment rhetoric on so many issues of National importance, such as immigration, debt, education, and health care finance reform. And the TEA Party will not scarf up these newly minted Indies, they are too radical.

    ACA ‘insures’ two things:

    1.) Kids born today will be in awe that health insurance used to come with a job, when they are 21;
    2.) ACA insures that those that can afford fee-for-service medical care will have the best doctors, hospitals, and care outcomes. Everyone else will have what the Patient Advisory Board deems ‘sufficient.’

    Never heard of PAB?

    You will if you are diagnosed with multiple sclerosis, HIV/AIDS, virtually any chronic illness that you live with for years. PAB decides the norms and anyone diagnosed with disease that cause outliers in cost or modality of care will suffer.

    ACA is the Holy Grail of government interference in our lives, cradle to grave control for those unable to control themselves, and yet it will help millions, like Clint.

    Opposing the ACA without replacement will buy a Dem House in 2016, bank it…

    I was right about the last general election cycle and I will be right about this….

    • Harry says:

      I expect the country will vote Democratic in 2016 and the country will become a de facto one party state after that. That being the case, why should conservatives like me continue to support a GOP that is in the process of selling out their principles – and in spite of it will never again be a political force? Because I support freedom to succeed and survive or fail and die, I oppose the ACA without replacement. Government provides only make believe feel good solutions and will never foster the greater good of individual responsibility. If I were younger, I’d move to a less invasive country (of which there are many) and never look back.

    • seenbetrdayz says:

      “1.) Kids born today will be in awe that health insurance used to come with a job, when they are 21;”

      It may ensure that kids born today will be in awe that people used to have jobs, lol.

  7. Bull Moose says:

    Buzz, Thank you for posting this link and for allowing for an outlet for an open debate and discussion of the important issue of health insurance in our country.

    As you can tell, this is a very serious issue for me and millions of others with pre-existing conditions whom cannot buy insurance in the individual marketplace. I am a cancer survivor and I have faced many issues and obstacles as it relates to obtaining health insurance since surviving my battle with cancer. Even after 10 years as a survivor, in 2010, and by most accounts considered “cured”, insurers found other reasons to deny coverage – sleep apnea and oddly enough medication I take for anxiety.

    To the notion that my weight affects me having sleep apnea, I have both a deviated septum and an enlarged soft palate, two items that have nothing to do with how I take care of myself. As John Walraven stated, seeking treatment through CPAP is taking care of myself because, going without CPAP would lead to very serious health conditions that are much more costly and difficult to treat.

    As it relates to Karen Handel, I consider Karen a friend. I worked as hard as I could on her campaign for Governor to help her become the Governor of Georgia. I have a strong belief in the unique qualities of her background, the skill set she brings to the table, and the perspective that she has to offer in the debate and execution of public policy in our state and country. However, as it relates to this issue, and because this issue is so very important to me and many of the people that I love and care about, her position on the Affordable Care Act is unacceptable to me and I cannot continue to support her campaign for Senate. I trust that she respects our honest policy disagreement. Anything beyond that need not be discussed further through this forum.

    In implementing the reforms of the Affordable Care Act, most elected officials under Republican Party banner have stood on the sidelines and voted 40 times to repeal the law. Instead of engaging in the process and addressing specific areas of concern in a bipartisan manner, they have instead adopted a blanket position of all or nothing as it relates to this issue. This is an unrealistic position and defies logic as it relates to the legislative process. Our country was founded on a series of compromises. The United States of America would not exist except for the wisdom of our founders and their willingness to find areas of agreement and forge a path forward.

    The current system in our country penalizes entrepreneurship. So many people stay in their jobs because of nothing more than access to health insurance. Removing barriers, like pre-existing conditions, from obtaining health insurance on the individual market will empower individuals to take the chance on their big idea and lead to greater innovation in our country!

    Additionally, by removing barriers to access to health insurance, we will help lower the overall cost of healthcare in this country. Instead of various illnesses being treated at a critical point for the patient, preventive care will help reduce costs and ensure that our citizens are healthier, more productive, and do not live in fear of going broke because they get sick. Quality of care will improve as we make conscious efforts to examine best practices and duplicate those practices in other parts of the country.

    This law has stood challenges all the way to the Supreme Court and is clearly the standing law of the land. Continued efforts to defy the law or make it unreasonably difficult for citizens to get accurate information regarding sign up and accessibility are unfortunate political actions by our elected officials. We are past the point of reasonable and acceptable disagreement and many of our current elected officials are fear mongering and offering nothing but lowest common denominator buzz words. What a disgrace.

    I will be among the first to sign up for the healthcare exchange when it opens on October 1, 2013, in Georgia and am very relieved that the stress of living without health insurance and having to worry about my pre-existing conditions will soon be over.

  8. Three Jack says:

    “Instead of engaging in the process and addressing specific areas of concern in a bipartisan manner, they have instead adopted a blanket position of all or nothing as it relates to this issue.”

    Yea because Obama, Pelosi, Reid et al were certainly open to “bi-partisan” input as they passed this newest form of big government BS without even reading what they wrote. (Ironically after reading it, they immediately exempted themselves from its ramifications in a bi-partisan decision).

    Your dem friends already decided against bi-partisanship, the GOP is left to do whatever it can to shine the light on this law that increases cost, decresases coverage. But you don’t care about that because you’re getting what you want no matter the consequences to the vast majority who were happy with their healthcare coverage as it was pre-Obama/Roberts.

    • John Konop says:

      1) …….Your dem friends already decided against bi-partisanship, the GOP is left to do whatever it can to shine the light on this law that increases cost, decresases coverage……

      In all due respect your comment is illogical. One the macro plan was created by Newt and a leading conservative think tank.

      2) ….. law that increases cost, decresases coverage……….

      All studies show that with the flaws the rate of increase is less under the new bill, and saves tax payers money.

      3) …..But you don’t care about that because you’re getting what you want no matter the consequences ….

      Once again this allows people to pay in instead of using an emergency room with forced healthcare paid/subsidized by tax payers or no service…….

      4) …vast majority who were happy with their healthcare coverage as it was pre-Obama/Roberts…

      Is this a joke? I would love to see the numbers on people who have a HMO…….

      The bill needs improvement….but attacking people trying to do the right thing is wrong!

      • KingRichard says:

        Obamacare is the Worst Bill evah! Have to pass before we see what is in it. Passed behind closed doors, never read, written by lobbyists who stand to be the ones who make all the money.

        http://thehill.com/business-a-lobbying/318577-architects-of-obamacare-reap-windfall-as-washington-lobbyists

        Unions supported it and now hate it, Democrats wrote it and now excempt themsleves from it, President gives waivers as favors and to some companies, other companies restructuring their plans or removing them, busniess terrifed to begin or grow, 7 of every 8 jobs created under Obama is Part time because of Obamacare, the velocity of money at a standstill because we are all terrified of the future.

        Republicans had 6 years of President and both Houses and did nothing, Democrats needed less than 2 years to ram through the worst bill in history. If our Representatives don’t do everything in their power to stop Obamacare we will be very bad shape. We simply cannot afford it.

        Government makes things worse, a few things about Obamacare are good – covering preexisting conditions, covering children longer I can barely tolerate these although we will all pay more because of it.

        It is the worst bill in American History…passed in a terrible one party way and the Democrats refused Republican help and aid on the bill, and to this day I still hate Bart Stupak as the last Democrat who still had a inkling to believe that we should not cover abortions in the bill. Death Panels have come to life they exist in the bill but no one would listen they only mocked and ridiculed while flaring smoke screens to hide themsleves.

        Hillary Clinton 2004 “I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration that somehow you’re not patriotic. And we should stand up and say ‘We are Americans and we have a right to disagree with any administration.'”

        Worst ever!

        • John Konop says:

          Do you really believe what you wrote? You scream death panels and are against covering people with preexisting conditions….You scream democrats wrote a bill first implemented by a Republican governor……Wow…..Do facts matter at all?

      • Three Jack says:

        John, I was addressing Clint with my response to his post. I am confident he has the capacity to reply if he chooses. You and I have debated this topic for many years, I see no need to continue since we obviously disagree. And nobody is ‘attacking’ anybody, just trying to be sure both sides are covered.

        • John Konop says:

          I thought I was facing the same situation as Clint about a month ago. I can relate to what Clint is dealing with…..I only pray you will learn to walk in the shoes of other people….if you did you would see the problems with your comments on this issue.

                  • seenbetrdayz says:

                    The old system was a consequence of gov’t intervention. The new system is a consequence of gov’t intervention. I think it’s a bit early to declare that we’ve improved anything.

                    Wait until premiums triple for the average American and more people discover that they fall within the poverty limit to accept taxpayer-subsidized insurance. I probably qualify myself, and I’m not that bad off. Maybe I’ll apply for gov’t assistance.

              • Harry says:

                BIG ROCK CANDY MOUNTAIN

                On a summer day in the month of May
                A burly bum came hiking
                Down a shady lane through the sugar cane
                He was looking for his liking
                As he roamed along he sang a song
                Of the land of milk and honey
                Where a bum can stay for many a day
                And he won’t need any money

                Chorus
                Oh the buzzin’ of the bees in the cigarette trees
                Near the soda water fountain
                At the lemonade springs where the bluebird sings
                On the big rock candy mountain

                There’s a lake of gin we can both jump in
                And the handouts grow on bushes
                In the new-mown hay we can sleep all day
                And the bars all have free lunches
                Where the mail train stops and there ain’t no cops
                And the folks are tender-hearted
                Where you never change your socks and you never throw rocks
                And your hair is never parted (Chorus)

                Oh, a farmer and his son, they were on the run
                To the hay field they were bounding
                Said the bum to the son, “Why don’t you come
                To that big rock candy mountain?”
                So the very next day they hiked away,
                The mileposts they were counting
                But they never arrived at the lemonade tide
                On the big rock candy mountain (Chorus)

                Attributed to Haywire Mac MacClintock

          • Three Jack says:

            John, I stand by all my comments on this issue and would do so no matter my own personal health situation. And btw, every man faces cancer at some point or at least a symptom. In my case, it’s not a matter of if, moreso than when as my family has a long history of prostate cancer. So stop with the pity party and start taking responsibilty for your own self instead of demanding government do it for you.

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