Tuesday Open Thread

Two weeks from today the Primary Runoff will take place. Which means we have two more weeks to deal with the madness of the sock puppets.

So here’s an open thread. Enter at your own risk.


      • John Konop says:


        It all depends on what side of the equation if you are waiting for the liver…..you would have a different perspective. If it was me I would rather give away an opportunity for life especially if it was family.

      • “Always on the side of death.”

        It seems to me that Mr. Phebus is old enough to choose for himself. We’re not talking fetuses who have no ability to communicate. Mr. Phebus has eloquently explained his decision and I think it should be his right to do with his own life as he pleases.

        Furthermore, this is more on the side of life than death. If his organs could save three or four other peoples’ lives, is that not on the side of life instead?

          • Lady Thinker says:

            To John Konop, David Staples, and Byteme if you are reading this:

            Please allow me to interupt your serious thread for a moment.

            I found this link for the state budget that seems to start with FY2008 through FY 2011. It looks like some permanent changes were made that is designed to be sustainable over several years, hence, no furloughs for some departments like maybe Karen’s old Secretary of State budget. I wonder how much of this budget Karen may have contributed to but finances is not my area of expertise. I think that part starts on page 336. Can any of you finance people look at this and break it down for the financial dummies like me?


  1. I’m happy to see that Sanford Bishop is starting to look a little desperate in GA-2:


    I think that it’s winnable, though Mike Keown still has a long way to go. If I had to call the race today, I’d say 57% Bishop to 43% Keown. That’s better than most candidates have done for the past decade, but it’s still not a win. But there are still quite a few weeks until the general election and I’ll be interested to see what he does in between now and then.

    • Ambernappe says:

      I am pleased to see documentation in print. I had read it all, but many voters do not take the time. I also questioned Maria directly and did not detect any hesitation in her answers. No, I am not naive. Maria appreciates the opportunity provided by Secretary Oxendine and does not comment about him except to acknowledge this. She does speak of her plans for change in the department and has a real interest in the specifics of how insurance affects people. Her intelligence and personal drive are obvious.

    • jgw2cpa says:

      This was a great analysis. It really points out the differences between the two candidates and also brings these whisper attacks to light. The time has come for NEW people in power. Get Informed Georgia and vote for Maria Sheffield on Aug 10th.

  2. Jeremy Jones says:

    I very well may end up voting for Nathan Deal, but did anyone else see the debate on Saturday where he criticized Handel for quitting her job early?!!?

    • John Konop says:

      Nathan Deal went after Karen for quitting her job early when he quit his before being thrown out of congress on ethical scandal issues? Now this is bizarre!

      • Provocateur says:

        “thrown out of Congress”….yeah, let’s dispense with trials or rules of evidence and just stick to one side of every accusation.

        • John Konop says:


          You sound like Charlie Rangel. Deal and Rangel got caught and should do the right thing and retire. Both parties have no creditability because too many in the party protect their own over doing what is best for the country. I pledge allegiance to our country not a party.

          • B Balz says:

            Charley Rangel and Nathan Deal have as much in common as Fred Flintstone and Ronald Reagan. Nothing, nada, zip.

            DO BETTER!

            • John Konop says:

              Deal and Rangel both got caught and were found guilty by a bipartisan House ethics committee.

              Well, it took 18 months, but the House ethics committee has concluded that Rep. Charlie Rangel (D-N.Y.), the one-time chairman of the Ways and Means Committee, violated ethics rules and would face a trial of sorts starting next week. That’s also when a public statement of violation will be released. Even though much of it might already be known, I can’t wait to read it. What we already do know is pretty extraordinary.

              The committee has had a lot to look into. But my favorite, hands down, is his amended financial disclosure forms that revealed not one but two checking accounts — CHECKING — with up to $500,000 in them. How that slips the mind of the man who at the time was the powerful


              • B Balz says:

                I had a thought about Rep. Rangel last week. Perhaps, the reason he is going through with the trial is that he knows he is toxic with the Dems.

                Who benefits from a public, humiliating trial? Perhaps GOP friends?

                To link Rep. Deal in any rumor way to Rep. Rangel is neither humorous or accurate.

                  • B Balz says:


                    If you are saying that they share this thing together, then I say Rangel got away with way too much, for way too long.

                    Movin’ on, amigo, I just think this is a straw grab.

                    • Lady Thinker says:

                      Just like when Deal voted to give half a million or more for abortions, then tries to get the spotlight off him by getting GRTL to attack Karen.

                    • B Balz says:

                      See LT you can get in there with the best of them. Is it worse to be making nasty references like bs or perpetuating a durn lie?

                      Hyde Act prevents what you said from ever occurring, you know it and so doe your fellow ________________.

                  • KariDee says:

                    It DOES NOT find him guilty of anything. The report clearly states the it is INCONCLUSIVE. Quit spreading LIES JOHN KONOP. You will lose all credibility if you keep it up.

          • Lady Thinker says:

            You are right John. Deal quit, changed his mind, and quit Congress again, all in two weeks to avoid the ethics charges. He quit to save his skin.

            • polisavvy says:

              Yes, contrary to the belief of his followers, that’s exactly what he did. Of course, it was under the guise of the health care vote. And, as I recall, his vote didn’t matter in the end.

      • LoyaltyIsMyHonor says:

        True John, except Karen has made it a habit to jump from one job to the next. So our choices are a corrupt former Congressman and a proven liar who can’t seem to finish out a term in office?

        I’m dying here. I think I’m just going to skip the runoff…sigh 🙁

        • biagio bruno says:

          Send a contribution to Austin Scott. It won’t change the race for governor, but you’ll feel better.

      • Tireless says:

        Being a tool for Handel doesn’t give you the creative license to make up the facts to suit your agenda. Deal said Handel has NEVER finished ANY elected position. I think Deal completed quite a few terms in both the state and federal government. I am not a fan of Deal but someone needs to steer the Handel sock puppets back to reality. She’s a self-serving quitter…….which probably explains Palin’s endorsement.

    • Provocateur says:

      Yawn. An ethics complaint against Handel? This is HandelPundit. It will not get posted as a thread. No way. Everyone on this blog is pro-Handel, which means no publication of anything against Handel.

    • Andre says:

      Simon’s company, ID Builders, has taken money from Johnson, McBerry and Oxendine.

      I wonder if this ethics complaint is sour grapes from Handel dispatching three of Bill Simon’s clients.

      • zigmaster says:

        Maybe Bill Simon hates Karen’s guts and she also violated campaign law. Doesn’t have to be either/or.

        • Provocateur says:

          Zig…don’t introduce sound logic on this blog…it might cause it to split apart. Let Andre go on his merry way, wearing the glasses of a particular tint he so chooses.

          • Andre says:

            All I’m saying is this:

            If it takes me all of 5 minutes to research Bill Simon’s connections to former opponents of Karen Handel, how long will it take for this ethics complaint to be spun as sour grapes from someone who’s taken thousands of dollars from Johnson, McBerry and Oxendine — three people Handel beat in the July 20th GOP primary.

            • zigmaster says:

              According to your theory, Simon should be equally upset with the Deal campaign also. Seems like the 2.8% pts that Deal beat Johnson by probably cost Simon some business.

              Candidate Date Amount
              John Oxendine 04/20/2009 $2,901.00
              Eric Johnson 06/09/2009 $2,171.30
              Eric Johnson 06/09/2009 $1,807.06
              John Oxendine 02/04/2009 $1,519.56
              John Oxendine 03/06/2009 $902.09
              John Oxendine 08/05/2009 $1,053.00
              Ray McBerry 07/30/2009 $842.70
              Eric Johnson 01/11/2010 $211.79
              Eric Johnson 04/09/2010 $13,045.70

              • Provocateur says:

                Whoa! There’s no Deal payment there? I thought Andre had a real argument there. Guess not.

            • Provocateur says:

              There’s a difference between “spin” and a sworn statement. From the copy from Galloway’s post, Mr. Simon swore a statement, and provided the copies of the evidence he had.

              Handel may spin it and rip Simon to shreds via her people and her sock puppets on this blog and others.

              But, the evidence is still the evidence as shown, and if all they do is attack Simon, that will show them to be nothing more than empty suits who are not ethical in any way, and more like the Clintons in Bloodsport.

              • Andre says:

                Complaints sworn with the State Ethics Commission are a joke.

                They are done by political enemies of certain candidates in order to score a quick story in the newspaper.

                Hell, I’ve been the subject of an ethics complaint and it was unanimously dismissed by the bipartisan Federal Elections Commission.

                Still, the point was to create a headache for me as I had to defend myself against alleged ethical improprieties until the final disposition of the complaint.

                More often than not, ethics complaints are frivolous pieces of garbage from folks hoping that something sticks to their political opponents.

                • Provocateur says:

                  I don’t know, Andre. Have you actually read the complaint? Here’s Jim Galloway’s link to the actual complaint:


                  It doesn’t sound very “frivolous” when Simon has a copy of an e-mail from Handel’s husband telling him in late 2008 that Handel had decided to run for Governor. Then Karen Handel claims she spent $10,000 in March 2009 from her secretary of state account on “campaign activities for Secr. of State.”

                  • Andre says:

                    I have read the complaint, and it comes off as speculative at best and frivolous at worst.

                    I doubt we’d be seeing this complaint from Bill Simon if the money spent on others was instead spent on him and his company.

                    One more thing, Bill Simon’s ID Builders received $1,370.63 from the Handel campaign in 2006. Simon wasn’t so critical of her then. In fact, in the emails listed as evidence in the complaint, Simon seemed to be supportive of Karen Handel running for re-election as Georgia’s Secretary of State.

                    From the emails:

                    “Honestly, I’d actually rather have her stay as SoS because if we end-up with a doofus like Bill Stephens to replace her, I’m going to kick your ass as a proxy for kicking Governor Handel’s ass.”

                    Things must have gone downhill once Handel announced for governor, because suddenly, Bill Simon launched into his criticisms of candidate Handel and began receiving payments from three other GOP gubernatorial candidates.

                    Maybe Bill Simon is angry because Handel ended his candidate consulting gravy train.

                  • John Konop says:


                    Bipartisan House ethics committee finds Nathan Deal guilty vs. Bill I sold stuff for profit to her competition for Governor Simon.

                    Issue at hand:

                    Nathan Deal use power of position to get an inside deal to make a 150k a year off tax payers vs. Bill Simon using personal off the record e-mails with her husband on the timing of issue of how 10k was spent.


                    I have known Bill Simon for years and ironically was introduced to Karen and Steve through Bill. At that time he was very upset about the nasty personal nature of the campaign against Karen (SOS race). And he told me numerous times how Karen was one the most competent, bright, straight shooting politician he had ever met.

                    Bill if you reading this, what you did here demonstrated no class as well as the personal attacks you have been spewing against Karen this race. How could you of all people lead this nasty personal attacks Karen?

                    I remember Bill Simon one time insisting I meet with a very good friend of his at a function. The gentleman was a lawyer and at that time head of the Log Cabin Republicans in Georgia his name escapes me.

                    I had an honest conversation how at the time my son was going to have an openly gay teacher his next year in school (grade school) and my wife and I ended up moving him to another school. It was a very open and honest exchange between us about the issue. The irony is Bill Simon thought my wife and I overreacted. I made it clear I am all for gay people having equal rights put as a parent it separates at that point.

                    I am not sure to this day if my wife and I made the right decision. But I am sure I want the personal liberties to make the call. And being open about sexuality gay or not is not acceptable in front of kids in our household opinion.

                    It blows my mind Bill Simon would be in charge of gay bashing and the above personal attacks, especially after the above story. Bill you should apologize to Karen and Steve.

                    • Doug Deal says:

                      Buy a couple hundred of baubles from Bill junk dealing business, and I am sure they will get that apology, and perhaps he will switch sides and back Handel.

                      Bill Simon has seemingly always backed the higheat bidder, even if those “highest” bids were just a few pieces of silver.

                    • KariDee says:

                      FALSE again John Konop. It seems that you have learned a lesson from your master Karen Handel. How to LIE.

                    • Doug Deal says:

                      Repeating something does not make it true.

                      Deal was ripping the people of the state off by using his influence for his exclusive Atlanta regional authority to provide space for vehicle inspections.

                      One does not have to receive direct payments from the state to benefit improperly from actions of the state.

                      Act anyone who had to lug a car from downtown Atlanta to Gainseville to get a clear inpection after a salvage title was issued. Not only was it improper, it preyed on people who suffered a loss due to an accident, many of which were poor people who could not afford a new vehicle after it was totalled. How completely repugnant.

                    • KariDee says:

                      Doug Deal,
                      Again, a puppet well trained by the puppet master. There was no monopoly. Any person with a garage could have offered their location as a state inspection station…..and charge the patrons of that station whatever they wanted to. Also, any person with an automobile to be inspected could have taken their car to any inspection station in the state, there were at least 9, or……..wait for it…….called the state for an inspection of their vehicle at their own home. Of course that usually took a little longer to accomplish, since inspectors were busy traveling the state to inspect vehicles at the various locations around the state.

                    • KariDee says:

                      Oh, and one other thing…..ignorant Doug, most vehicles that are salvaged are paid for by insurance companies, then sold at auction to certified auto salvage rebuilders. So….about 90% of the patrons of the inspection program were auto dealers.

                      My advice to you is to get educated on a subject before you try to argue it……I’ve been in the middle of it my entire life.

                    • John Konop says:


                      YOU SAID:

                      …..Oh, and one other thing…..ignorant Doug, most vehicles that are salvaged are paid for by insurance companies, then sold at auction to certified auto salvage rebuilders. So….about 90% of the patrons of the inspection program were auto dealers…..

                      THE REAL DEAL:

                      What you are saying is all of us who pay our car insurance put money in Nathan Deals pocket? And further it was in a non-competitive situation which left us who play by the rules with no voice and short on some money by increased rates by the insurance companies that were a past on and put in Nathan Deals pocket.

                    • KariDee says:

                      You are nothing more than a distorter of the truth. Insurance premiums had NOTHING to do with that business…….you are a true nut job sir.

                    • John Konop says:


                      An insurance company makes money by charging customers. If some of the customers do not pay who do you think pays the difference?

                  • zigmaster says:

                    Karen needs to provide the receipts for these expenses and clearly show that they were for services rendered prior to her announcement of running for Governor. That is what the only “ethical” candidate for Governor would do.

                    Melissa Holder
                    contract work for Sec of State campaign related activities

                    Melissa Holder
                    contract work for Sec of State campaign related activities

                    Melissa Holder
                    contract work for Sec of State campaign related activities

                    Melissa Holder
                    contract work for Sec of State campaign related activities

                    contract work for Sec of State campaign related activities

                  • Lady Thinker says:

                    The alledged emails from Steve are just that, alledged, as there is nothing to indicate they are real.

                    • KariDee says:

                      Am I the only person here that has noticed that if there are allegations against her candidate…..LT is the first to jump on the “they are only alligations” band wagon, but if they are against another candidate…..allegations are absolute fact????!!!!

                    • Lady Thinker says:

                      Deal has proven ethical violations, Karen has allegations against her probably by pawns of corrupt Deal.

                    • Provocateur says:

                      Ain’t nothing been “proven” regarding Deal. No court, no commission, no committee has conclusively voted that Deal is guilty of anything.

                      LT, I pity the students you supposedly “teach.” No wonder our education in this state is in the toilet…because of teachers like you who don’t know right from wrong who are put in charge of educating children.

                    • Lady Thinker says:


                      Again, you don’t know what you are talking about and trying to attack me shows that. My students aren’t brainwashed by me. They pick a topic and have to argue both sides so they can make clear decisions. Sometimes they change their minds about an issue, sometimes they don’t, but I haven’t put education in the toliet, you closed minded people have.

  3. Progressive Dem says:

    Does Pro Life Just Mean Pro Fetus in Georgia ???

    Georgia is the 8th worst state in infant mortality (day1 to year1)
    Georgia is 10th worst in low weight babies
    Georgia is 17th worst in child deaths (year 1-14)
    Georgia is 17th worst in deaths to teenagers
    Georgia is 8th worst in births to teenagers (15-19)
    Georgia is 8th worst in teenagers not in school and not working

    • zigmaster says:

      And government will fix all that? Let me guess, elect a bunch of democrats, raise taxes on the rich, and presto!

      • Progressive Dem says:

        You’d guess wrong. The first step is acknowledge the problem and commit to improving. Government doesn’t have a silver bullett, nor the resources. If Georgia wants to address these problems, the solution will come from tthe public and private sector, non-profits and faith based organizations and individual volunteers. It’s sort of a pay now or pay later issue. We have one of the highest incarceration rates in the world. Georgia spends over $1billion each year for corrections. So we can either pay attention to children or we can apy attention to convicts.

          • Progressive Dem says:

            Yeah, we will. But ignoring the bigger problem is fiscally short-sighted. Police and courts are one of biggest expenditures of local government. Courts and corrections are one of the biggest expenses of state government. The “let the market take care of itself” position is not fiscally conservative, nor Christian.

    • Doug Deal says:

      And this data is bogus because it does not take into account racial differences.

      By race, here are the rankings (lowest at top) for infant mortality (From Kaiser State Health Facts http://www.statehealthfacts.org):

      Whites 6.1 (31/51)
      Blacks 13.0 (16/40) – 11 states do not report data.

      The only reason that Georgia is near the bottom of the combined number, when they are actuall near the middle on the individual numbers is the nationwide difference between racial groups. Georgia has one of the highest black populations in the nation.

      Few people ever bother to understand the limitations on the data they report as “proof”.

      • Progressive Dem says:

        Oh, I see black people don’t count in infant mortality. Wow! A baby is a baby unless he’s black? Then we discount the fact that he dies. Are black babies not Georgians? What a stupid racist comment.

        • John Konop says:

          Progressive Dem,

          Doug meant nothing racist about his comments. But if you do not look at numbers by proper sub-grouping and analysis it correctly than the numbers are meaningless.

        • Doug Deal says:

          Just because you Dems think that way about blacks, doesn’t mean others do. Unlike you, I am actually part black, jewish, american indian, and white, so I take serious offense at your ridiculous comment. It says something about your lack of character that you would “go there”, and points out the severity of the absolute racist steeped rhetoric of the Democrat party.

          Thanks for showing everyone how big of a racist a-hole you are.

          That being said, I make no claims as to the reasoning that nationwide, blacks have higher infant mortality, in my opinion is is probably related to the racist programs instituted by democrats to keep them on the plantation of government handouts. A great man once called this the soft racism of lowered expectations.

          Another explanation could also be that the genetic diversity of African population is much higher than that in Asian and White populations. This genetic diversity could lead to greater genetic problems that could affect the health of babies and fetuses. One way to test this would be to report the data on mixed race children. If it is because of genetic issues, the trend should continue in the mixed race children, who would share the genetic diversity of the more diverse parent. If it does not, then the issue is likely caused by socio-economic factors.

          • Progressive Dem says:

            Merriam-Webster’s Dictionary defines racism as a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority or inferiority of a particular racial group.

            I’m not going to wrestle with a pig. We both will get dirty and the pig will enjoy it. You ought to be walking back your comments instead of digging a bigger hole. If you feel so proud of your post go ask a black person what they think of it. Where’s Slyram?

            • Doug Deal says:

              Here is a prime example of why the Democrat party is moraly bankrupt. To raise bogus charges of racism to win points in an insignificant argument diminishes the people that had to suffer through the injustices of your Democrat forbearers.

              I am sick of racist Democrats and the hatred they have for blacks and other minorities that simply states they cannot compete without your help. How disgusting.

              • Progressive Dem says:

                Why don’t you stop trying to change the subject to the Democrats, and instead explain why the “data is bogus because it does not take into account racial differences.”

                • Doug Deal says:

                  There is no need to explain anything to a racist troll like you. Anyone who will make light of the struggles of blacks to overcome true racism in our country by going to that well out of habit is a disgusting human being. Sham on you.

                  If you want to see the personification of white racism in America, look no further than a liberal Democrat.

                    • Progressive Dem says:

                      If you think I am the least bit persuaded by your aberrant rantings, you are are surely mistaken.

                      Perhaps you don’t want to explain to me, but why don’t you explain why the data is bogus to the rest of Peach Pundit. I’m sure others are interested.

          • Lady Thinker says:

            Doug Deal,

            Don’t let them get to you. Your friends believe in you and support your posts.

    • GaConservative23 says:

      Now THIS is something we won’t hear about again from any of the posters on this site.

      I’m surprised zig’s comment is still up.

      • Doug Grammer says:

        In an open thread toward the bottom? No, they won’t bother with it. However, don’t expect a new thread proclaiming how Erick was wrong.

  4. B Balz says:

    VIA: AJC
    URL: http://www.politifact.com/georgia/statements/2010/jul/28/erick-erickson/redstatecom-blogger-said-nathan-deal-voted-fund-ab/

    “…Erickson’s claim crumbles in the face of the facts.

    The Family Planning Amendments Act of 1993 didn’t fund anything. What it would have done was re-authorize a federal family planning program that is explicitly barred from funding abortions. Funding for actual abortions was never up for debate, and the bill never passed. …”

    I am disappointed that PeachPundit has gone to this level. I would not blame a savvy Rep. Deal ethics charge for not disclosing ‘like-kind’ contributions by PeachPundit, if not disclosed by Team Handel.

    Those who support Ms. Handel ought to ‘cease and desist’ from your absurd references to Rep. Deal funding abortions. It is both morally and intellectually wrong.

    If you cannot win this thing speaking about HOW Ms. Handel plans to navigate Georiga through our $1Bn budget hole, or some other issue germane to REALITY, then stop speaking.

    BTW, I do not work with Rep. Deal in any way. Right is right and fair is fair.


    • Provocateur says:

      The pollsters over at Insider Advantage know what the numbers are and will not release them.

  5. southgapassion says:

    Since my reply wasn’t posted on the “Ray’s the Bee’s Knee’s” blog (sic) I’ll repost to the open thread in an effort to respect whatever censorship has happened for whatever reason. Seeing as it is an open thread…here was my post.

    As a mom, my most pressing concern is the future of this nation for my children. You’d think it would be the daily ins and outs of motherhood. Do I have bandages? Daily Medicines? Who are my kids friends? What will we eat for dinner?

    It’s true, those used to be my most pressing concerns. More recently, however, the most heart pounding panic attacks I’ve had have been because of a growing concern for my children’s America. The America I grew up in and the path that it is on now are not similar in any way. Government swelling of debt, intrusion into my home, intrusion into my bank, intrusion into the private sector where my husband and I hold jobs and provide for our children. It’s overwhelming.

    Being someone who 3 years ago had never given a second thought to anything political, it’s somewhat refreshing now, as an active participant in local TEA Parties, to be able to get asked a question about my opinion on what’s going on, and actually be able to give an effective and factual response.

    With that being said, the first time I heard the name “Carl Smith” was when we were coordinating a July 4th TEA Party and looking for strong conservative TEA Party principled people to speak to and energize our crowd. A Conservative, Christian and quiet mannered man, Carl Smith took the podium and didn’t throw any books at us, didn’t tell us how good of a Christian he was, he basically said “I’m a dad, and as a dad my first priority is to protect my son. I don’t like the way this country is headed, it’s jeopardizing my son’s future, so I intend to do something about it”.

    Carl & I kept touch occasionally through Facebook until March, when the “Code Red” rally was held in Washington. A group of friends and I were discussing going up there and Carl messaged me “Got room for one more?”

    Fast forward to Tuesday, Primary day when I see this gentle giant, strength of steel and heart of a Champion stand up after receiving word of his “in a runoff status” and be humbled to have the ability to continue his effort to make a difference in his district, and his nation, it was awe inspiring. Because of his faith, because of his unwavering principles, because of his love of family & country, and because of his belief that feet on the street DO make a difference, my vote is for Carl Smith.

    I don’t have a blog, I don’t have a website and I’ll tell you just like I tell the left wing media, this is my country too, I fight the good fight and join with others who are willing to stand with me. We have two options here in GA 12 to fight Pelosi’s Puppet John Barrow, and for my district, I choose Carl Smith.

    • polisavvy says:

      I understand what you are saying. My children are grown; however, I worry about the future of my unborn grandchildren. What’s their life going to be like? What’s this country going to be like? I hope that you get your candidate elected. Good luck. I feel the same passion about my candidate in the 8th. Let’s hope we’re both happy on November 2nd. Once again, good luck!! 🙂

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