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	<title>Comments on: Georgia Power: Plant Vogtle price tag $1.5 billion lower than expected</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/</link>
	<description>Fresh Political Pickins From The Peach State</description>
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		<title>By: benevolus</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197350</link>
		<dc:creator>benevolus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2009 00:06:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197350</guid>
		<description>I just wanted to thank Jason Pye for the insightful article I found about all this. 
http://www.jasonpye.com/blog/2009/01/georgia_powers_poison_bill.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just wanted to thank Jason Pye for the insightful article I found about all this.<br />
<a href="http://www.jasonpye.com/blog/2009/01/georgia_powers_poison_bill.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.jasonpye.com/blog/2009/01/georgia_powers_poison_bill.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: macho</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197323</link>
		<dc:creator>macho</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 21:32:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197323</guid>
		<description>Of course there are about a thousand variables that would cause a nuclear power plant to come in under or over budget.  The plant can come in over budget and SB 31 could still have saved $1.5 billion or SB 31 could have cost us extra money, but the plant could come in under budget.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course there are about a thousand variables that would cause a nuclear power plant to come in under or over budget.  The plant can come in over budget and SB 31 could still have saved $1.5 billion or SB 31 could have cost us extra money, but the plant could come in under budget.</p>
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		<title>By: Icarus</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197320</link>
		<dc:creator>Icarus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 21:22:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197320</guid>
		<description>MD,

Can&#039;t tell you the number of years off hand, but I believe it is greater than 20.  These are long term assets, and the costs are generally recovered over a very long time horizon.

As for looking at the books for only the legally allowed costs, that is the responsibility of the Public Service Commission.  I know that they have to approve costs that they deem proper.  I have no idea which, if any, of these records are open for public inspection.

But if you read above, the $1.5 Billion has done exactly what you said.  It wasn&#039;t cut, it was just removed from capitalized interest expense on the balance sheet (that would then be amortized over that long period) to a direct expense on the income statement, with rate payers making up for the expense on the revenue side.

Accounting gimmick does not equal &quot;cost savings&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MD,</p>
<p>Can&#8217;t tell you the number of years off hand, but I believe it is greater than 20.  These are long term assets, and the costs are generally recovered over a very long time horizon.</p>
<p>As for looking at the books for only the legally allowed costs, that is the responsibility of the Public Service Commission.  I know that they have to approve costs that they deem proper.  I have no idea which, if any, of these records are open for public inspection.</p>
<p>But if you read above, the $1.5 Billion has done exactly what you said.  It wasn&#8217;t cut, it was just removed from capitalized interest expense on the balance sheet (that would then be amortized over that long period) to a direct expense on the income statement, with rate payers making up for the expense on the revenue side.</p>
<p>Accounting gimmick does not equal &#8220;cost savings&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: DonnieChaffin</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197319</link>
		<dc:creator>DonnieChaffin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 21:20:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197319</guid>
		<description>Is a &quot;company shill&quot; a step up from &quot;lobbyist&quot;? I&#039;m trying to determine if I&#039;ve been promoted or not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is a &#8220;company shill&#8221; a step up from &#8220;lobbyist&#8221;? I&#8217;m trying to determine if I&#8217;ve been promoted or not.</p>
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		<title>By: Mad Dog</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197316</link>
		<dc:creator>Mad Dog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 21:15:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197316</guid>
		<description>Ic and Ben,

Not sure I&#039;m following this good thread very well. My biggest question would be defining the &#039;life&#039; of the plant. 

5 years? 10 years? 20 years? Forever? 

Then, I think Ic has it right on what costs can be transferred to consumers before the plant goes online, if it ever does. 

Can I look at the books to make sure only the legally allowed costs are on my bill? Hmmmmmm, NO. 

Can I be sure that the $1.5 billion cost savings (?) isn&#039;t being moved to another expense to be passed along NOW instead of later? 

Just say Enron ... the best power company in the world ... until ... it got busted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ic and Ben,</p>
<p>Not sure I&#8217;m following this good thread very well. My biggest question would be defining the &#8216;life&#8217; of the plant. </p>
<p>5 years? 10 years? 20 years? Forever? </p>
<p>Then, I think Ic has it right on what costs can be transferred to consumers before the plant goes online, if it ever does. </p>
<p>Can I look at the books to make sure only the legally allowed costs are on my bill? Hmmmmmm, NO. </p>
<p>Can I be sure that the $1.5 billion cost savings (?) isn&#8217;t being moved to another expense to be passed along NOW instead of later? </p>
<p>Just say Enron &#8230; the best power company in the world &#8230; until &#8230; it got busted.</p>
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		<title>By: Sleepy Tom</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197314</link>
		<dc:creator>Sleepy Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 21:04:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197314</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m for nuclear too.  I&#039;m also in favor of a used uranium rod being shoved up the rear end of a certain Rules Chairman in the state senate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m for nuclear too.  I&#8217;m also in favor of a used uranium rod being shoved up the rear end of a certain Rules Chairman in the state senate.</p>
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		<title>By: Sleepy Tom</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197312</link>
		<dc:creator>Sleepy Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 21:01:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197312</guid>
		<description>&quot;Documents in secret&quot; do not prove one darn thing.

You folks who believe this tripe must be connected to Ga Power and Southern Company.  Company Shills.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Documents in secret&#8221; do not prove one darn thing.</p>
<p>You folks who believe this tripe must be connected to Ga Power and Southern Company.  Company Shills.</p>
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		<title>By: B Balz</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197252</link>
		<dc:creator>B Balz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:47:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197252</guid>
		<description>Yazoo Land Scandal is worth another 10 points, if I could give away points.  Fascinating!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yazoo Land Scandal is worth another 10 points, if I could give away points.  Fascinating!</p>
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		<title>By: B Balz</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197250</link>
		<dc:creator>B Balz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:41:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197250</guid>
		<description>Now is a great time to build any durn thing.  Construction costs, steel and concrete are down, labor is plentiful.

I am waiting for the Fat Lady, as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now is a great time to build any durn thing.  Construction costs, steel and concrete are down, labor is plentiful.</p>
<p>I am waiting for the Fat Lady, as well.</p>
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		<title>By: benevolus</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197246</link>
		<dc:creator>benevolus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:32:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197246</guid>
		<description>OK, thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK, thanks.</p>
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		<title>By: Icarus</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197244</link>
		<dc:creator>Icarus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:27:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197244</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not sure I understand your question, but I&#039;ll take a stab.

We&#039;re paying for &quot;financing costs&quot; in advance, not the &quot;hard&quot; construction costs.  Included in the financing costs is not just the interest on construction, but a provision to allow &quot;return on investment&quot; as part of financing costs.  ROI is known in layman&#039;s terms as &quot;profit&quot;, and we, the little guys, will be responsibile for paying Georgia Power&#039;s profit, in advance, on this plant.

GA Power is entitled to charge rate payers for the hard costs over the life of the plant.   Should the plant never come on line, they will still be entitled to do so under state law.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not sure I understand your question, but I&#8217;ll take a stab.</p>
<p>We&#8217;re paying for &#8220;financing costs&#8221; in advance, not the &#8220;hard&#8221; construction costs.  Included in the financing costs is not just the interest on construction, but a provision to allow &#8220;return on investment&#8221; as part of financing costs.  ROI is known in layman&#8217;s terms as &#8220;profit&#8221;, and we, the little guys, will be responsibile for paying Georgia Power&#8217;s profit, in advance, on this plant.</p>
<p>GA Power is entitled to charge rate payers for the hard costs over the life of the plant.   Should the plant never come on line, they will still be entitled to do so under state law.</p>
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		<title>By: benevolus</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197243</link>
		<dc:creator>benevolus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:22:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197243</guid>
		<description>What costs do they need to recoup if we are paying for it in advance?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What costs do they need to recoup if we are paying for it in advance?</p>
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		<title>By: Icarus</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197242</link>
		<dc:creator>Icarus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:19:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197242</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s the nature of the law in how new plants work.  Wouldn&#039;t matter if it were Nuclear, Coal, Hydro, or Magic Beanstalk green technology.  The law allows for the plant construction costs to be recouped with a return on investment.

One thing during our orginal coverage that I did not understand at the time but will correct now.  SB 31 did not put the ratepayers at additional risk.  If the plant never comes on line, but was approved by the PSC, the GA Power still has the right to recoup costs under the same law.   

This would be the same if they approved a new coal plant, but because of a new Cap/Trade law (or judges ruling) the plant was not allowed to operate, then the rate payers would still pay for the plant.

The problem with SB 31 is simple, and still remains:

1) GA Power is able to take profit, in advance, from rate payers, who have a higher cost of funds than GA Power.

2)  Only small customers are paying for this.  Large commercial customers were exempt from the rate hike.

I&#039;m for nuclear, and hope we build not just these but even more plants.   I&#039;m not for small businesses and retail customers subsidizing large users and, more importantly, giving GA Power $1 Billion of advanced, unearned profit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s the nature of the law in how new plants work.  Wouldn&#8217;t matter if it were Nuclear, Coal, Hydro, or Magic Beanstalk green technology.  The law allows for the plant construction costs to be recouped with a return on investment.</p>
<p>One thing during our orginal coverage that I did not understand at the time but will correct now.  SB 31 did not put the ratepayers at additional risk.  If the plant never comes on line, but was approved by the PSC, the GA Power still has the right to recoup costs under the same law.   </p>
<p>This would be the same if they approved a new coal plant, but because of a new Cap/Trade law (or judges ruling) the plant was not allowed to operate, then the rate payers would still pay for the plant.</p>
<p>The problem with SB 31 is simple, and still remains:</p>
<p>1) GA Power is able to take profit, in advance, from rate payers, who have a higher cost of funds than GA Power.</p>
<p>2)  Only small customers are paying for this.  Large commercial customers were exempt from the rate hike.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m for nuclear, and hope we build not just these but even more plants.   I&#8217;m not for small businesses and retail customers subsidizing large users and, more importantly, giving GA Power $1 Billion of advanced, unearned profit.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Pye</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197241</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Pye</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:15:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197241</guid>
		<description>10 points for the reference to the Yazoo Land Scandal. Patrick Henry would be proud.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>10 points for the reference to the Yazoo Land Scandal. Patrick Henry would be proud.</p>
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		<title>By: benevolus</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197238</link>
		<dc:creator>benevolus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:12:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197238</guid>
		<description>Aren&#039;t we essentially buying a nuclear power plant and GIVING it to a private company?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aren&#8217;t we essentially buying a nuclear power plant and GIVING it to a private company?</p>
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		<title>By: Icarus</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197228</link>
		<dc:creator>Icarus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 16:20:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197228</guid>
		<description>...For the love of God...

&quot;ATLANTA -- The official price tag for Georgia Power’s share of two new reactors at Plant Vogtle is now $1.5 billion lower than when the company originally requested permission to build them, according to testimony Tuesday before the Georgia Public Service Commission. &quot;

Key Words:  lower than when originally requested.

There is no real &quot;cost savings&quot;.   They shifted the costs from Georgia Power to small rate payers via the largest lobbying effort since the Yazoo Land Scandal.

And let&#039;s not forget, almost a Billion of those &quot;costs&quot; are advanced profits off the plant that GA Power shareholders will be allowed to receive off the backs of its small rate payers who unfortuntately, only have Reps and Senators to represent their interestes, and not over 70 lobbyists.

Nothing new to see here.   Move along.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;For the love of God&#8230;</p>
<p>&#8220;ATLANTA &#8212; The official price tag for Georgia Power’s share of two new reactors at Plant Vogtle is now $1.5 billion lower than when the company originally requested permission to build them, according to testimony Tuesday before the Georgia Public Service Commission. &#8221;</p>
<p>Key Words:  lower than when originally requested.</p>
<p>There is no real &#8220;cost savings&#8221;.   They shifted the costs from Georgia Power to small rate payers via the largest lobbying effort since the Yazoo Land Scandal.</p>
<p>And let&#8217;s not forget, almost a Billion of those &#8220;costs&#8221; are advanced profits off the plant that GA Power shareholders will be allowed to receive off the backs of its small rate payers who unfortuntately, only have Reps and Senators to represent their interestes, and not over 70 lobbyists.</p>
<p>Nothing new to see here.   Move along.</p>
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		<title>By: ByteMe</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197220</link>
		<dc:creator>ByteMe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 15:33:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197220</guid>
		<description>But it made for a good headline in the paper... and anyone want to wager that the headline will get used in an ad down the road?

The ultimate astroturfing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But it made for a good headline in the paper&#8230; and anyone want to wager that the headline will get used in an ad down the road?</p>
<p>The ultimate astroturfing.</p>
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		<title>By: Ramblinwreck</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197175</link>
		<dc:creator>Ramblinwreck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 12:00:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197175</guid>
		<description>This appears to be an attempt to pvovide some political cover before an upcoming election to those who voted for SB31 last year. I don&#039;t think it will work. As Jason points out these things always take longer and cost more than projected. It&#039;s way too early to come out with this kind of statement for any reason except to excuse this vote for the people who suppored the bill.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This appears to be an attempt to pvovide some political cover before an upcoming election to those who voted for SB31 last year. I don&#8217;t think it will work. As Jason points out these things always take longer and cost more than projected. It&#8217;s way too early to come out with this kind of statement for any reason except to excuse this vote for the people who suppored the bill.</p>
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		<title>By: Scottf</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197173</link>
		<dc:creator>Scottf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 11:24:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197173</guid>
		<description>I hate to burst anyone&#039;s bubble, but I think Georgia Power only reduced the 2017 &#039;in service&#039; cost, not the actual construction cost.  The $1.5 billion did not disappear and it is not savings.  Customers will simply pay the $1.5 billion before the plant goes in service instead of paying it (with an additional $300 million in interest) afterward.  So, if there is a savings, it would be the $300 million in avoided interest.  Whether avoided interest is a savings for you depends on how your cost of money compares to the interest rate you avoided.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hate to burst anyone&#8217;s bubble, but I think Georgia Power only reduced the 2017 &#8216;in service&#8217; cost, not the actual construction cost.  The $1.5 billion did not disappear and it is not savings.  Customers will simply pay the $1.5 billion before the plant goes in service instead of paying it (with an additional $300 million in interest) afterward.  So, if there is a savings, it would be the $300 million in avoided interest.  Whether avoided interest is a savings for you depends on how your cost of money compares to the interest rate you avoided.</p>
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		<title>By: AubieTurtle</title>
		<link>http://www.peachpundit.com/2009/11/10/georgia-power-plant-vogtle-price-tag-1-5-billion-lower-than-expected/comment-page-1/#comment-197160</link>
		<dc:creator>AubieTurtle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 02:29:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.peachpundit.com/?p=18224#comment-197160</guid>
		<description>Are you supporting Ray McBerry for governor?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are you supporting Ray McBerry for governor?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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