Many thanks to Elizabeth Christian for sending these in to Peach Pundit. I’ll be updating this as long as she keeps sending in pics.
Grift is also posting updates on Twitter. CL’s Thomas Wheatley will be keeping us updated as well.
By the way, here are the rules for this evening’s event.
[UPDATE] Orit Sklar sent me some videos from this evening. It is very hard to make out wha is being said, but maybe you’ll have better luck. You can watch them at her YouTube page.
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I see firearms aren’t on the verboten list. Unlike strollers, which truly are a menace.
Why do you think people always say “think of the children”?
No cameras? Didn’t say anything about phone video recorders, did it?
guns, tasers and knifes are fine.
And booze. Don’t forget the booze.
Yep, you need the booze when you’re in a mob with guns, tasers and knives. lol
unless it is Sunday
On a serious note, I saw Isakson’s “BIG PHARMA” pac ad on TV during the news. At a boy Johnny, great timing.
The GOP leadership’s version of the free-market is they get to choose the participants… leading to one of those “natural monopolies,” I hear talked about among their ranks.
I really hope people wise up and realize there are more than two sides to this issue.
But most likely, the BIG Government/ BIG Business collusionist will continue to divide and conquer us into willing accomplices.
For those that Enough is truly Enough, check out the solutions presented at Cato.org other sites dedicated to freedom and free markets.
I thought is was a given, but just in case… This plan that the Dem Leadership is proposing is a really, really, really BAD idea!
You can’t have the gov take over 18% of our economy and still consider this, our country, “Home of the Free.” It doesn’t work that way.
Umm… ok, let’s go back to those math word problems you used to hate: Current government budget is (round numbers) $3 trillion per year. GDP is running at $10 trillion. What percentage of the economy is the government?
And yet you think taking that 16% (that’s the real number) from the insurance companies is somehow going to make the country no longer “Home of the Free”.
Byte, thank you for demonstrating you ARE a Leftie. Thanks for playing that you’re a “centrist”, though.
Again… you got nothing “Bill” except anger and name calling. Unless, of course, you make something up, then you have that.
Not “anger” Byte. Facts. You’re exposed for what you are. Nothing other than Progressive Dem, Chapter 2.
You got “Facts”, bring ‘em on, instead of stupid invective that just makes you look like a putz (and I mean that in the literal translation of the word).
makes you look like a putz (and I mean that in the literal translation of the word).
Dude, if you have “penis” on your brain, don’t go looking in my direction for any kind of satisfaction of your needs and desires.
My biggest concern is that this will end up being just like social security.
If I pay into a retirement fund that the government keeps up with, and they go out and “borrow” from the retirement fund to pay for other government programs, then I’ll have a crappy retirement, at worst, and end up working at a Waffle House during the last years of my life.
If I pay into a healthcare fund that the government keeps up with, and they go and “borrow” from the healthcare fund to pay for other government programs, then I have no way to pay for my healthcare.
Of all the organizations in the world that I could trust to “hold on” to my money ’til I need it, the U.S. government is probably the last on that list.
OK, so don’t get the public OPTION. Buy your own insurance.
The public option will be designed as an incentive and the Dems will seek to punish people who opt for private.
Eventually, this will lead to only the “rich” being able to afford the private insurance (as opposed to lots of people at all different levels of prosperity now), and the “public insurance” turning into something akin to ANY one of the you-name-it public housing projects: absolute lowest-quality, feces-infested conditions.
In short, the “public option” will become the worst medical care possible…just like it is in Canada and Britain.
Keep on lying, you “progresssives.”
Sure, because Medicare has done this as well, right?
You keep making up stuff, Bill.
Byte
It’s easy to accuse me of making things up…when you post under a made-up name.
It’s a LOT harder to get me to agree with a progressive like you. As The Who sings “Won’t Get Fooled Again!”
AMF!
Yep, Bill, you’re definitely making things up. So today is “Angry Bill Day”, huh? It’s almost like schizophrenia with you.
The comment about France was intended to prove that it’s not true that a public option inevitably leads to only wealthy people being able to afford private insurance. It doesn’t really matter exactly where or who it is. It is happening right now. It is an example we can see. Your premise is just incorrect.
You make ‘working at Waffle House’ sound like a bad thing…..
80% of the people in France have supplemental insurance.
If/when “the Dems” try to make it unaffordable, oppose it then. Is there anything in particular about THIS plan that you don’t like, as opposed to the fictional plan that you are opposing?
Benevolous…I’m sorry, but “people in France” are not a “people” I wish to emulate in any way. So, citing statistics based on how THEY supposedly think (do we know anything about how this statistic was actually formulated?) actually downgrade your argument several levels.
There are still 1K people outside. Somebody tweeted it so it must be true.
Once it’s stated on the internet, it is true.
Thanks for making it so.
A scofflaw!
http://img22.yfrog.com/i/u33.jpg/
And an early video from everysandwich.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlRjPaeB6yI
What is a free speech zone?
It’s where the protesters are herded.
@macho & Dash Riptide – as crazy as it sounds – it really was where they had set up “if you are taken out you can go out to the free speech zone to protest” according to those giving out the “rules”!!!
It was definitely an interesting night. Ran into Bill Greene. Will have more tomorrow.
Please tell me you have video/audio of when he got really mad at least 3 or 4 times – especially with Constitution question. Phone battery was dead and laptop ERASED most of the audio I had Honestly I think it was user error and not the laptop!!! I guess that is what happens when “no cameras” are allowed and trying to record by laptop without the camera police catching me!!!
I do not and in my opinion Johnson never got “really mad”. I do wish I had video of the guys who were kicked out hopping and giggling outside the hall as they discussed how they made a scene.
What?!? You mean they wanted to make a scene??
I’m SHOCKED!
Rep. Hank Johnson (D-GA4) Healthcare Townhall Meeting – 08/10/2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOlB5KZE644
At the end of Rep. Hank Johnson’s townhall meeting on healthcare, after being told over and over that the federal government has to do something about this “crisis,” someone finally stood up and asked the question that OUGHT to be asked regarding every single piece of legislation that Congress votes on: “Where does the Constitution give you the authority for that?” We’re talking Article 1, Section 8 here — where the actual powers of Congress are ENUMERATED.
Hank Johnson’s response was to ramble on about the Preamble, where it says to “promote the general welfare” — as if that gives Congress the power to do anything in the world it wants to!
This is exactly what’s wrong here: Members of Congress who have NO CLUE what the U.S. Constitution even SAYS, much less what it MEANS.
Vote all 434 of them out! (We all know there’s ONE who should stay!)
The real surprise was the healthcare panel. Seven on the panel and only two supported ObamaCare. (Michael Young, CEO of Grady and Dr. Patrice Harris with AMA) One even talked about person responsibility. One, Dr. Todd Williamson with GMA got several rounds of strong applause and standing ovations. Guy is a genuine conservative. He needs to be on conservative townhall meeting panels..
Over all, it was a very well run and organized event. Probably one of the best well run town halls.
I concur.
This portion of the forum is what compelled me to go. The panel, all well vetted medical professionals discussed their perspective of the health industry financing issue. The Grady ER doc was compelling in his assessment that when insurance runs out, and you are sent to Grady, they will take you in. That we cannot lose Grady, it is one of the Nations’ top tertiary (teaches, trains, plus acute care) hospitals. (Emory is a prime beneficiary of Grady for training new docs.)
The points that stick out to me:
Grady CEO was impressed that in 30 years he had never seen a Town Hall meeting like this. His omments reflected his view that private insurance is not enough to cover all folks.
One gentleman commented that HR3200 is not thru conference committee or even close to pasage, so how could Cong. Johnson’s team make solid guarantees about it?
The man from Medical Association of GA drew almost universal applause from both constituents and the organized protesters.
Frankly, the protesters were a bit obnoxious, barely staying within the bounds of civil discourse. When they made noise, I agreed with them.
Cong. Johnson made two references to ‘Blue Dog” Dems (DINO’s) and how they watered down the current bill. (That makes me really suspicious)
Final point: Some of the folks Cong. Johnson represents are truly in dire straights, have been and may always be. There will always be an element of any society that just cannot ‘bootstrap’ themselves. The call for personal responsibility was met with universal applause.
This is not an issue about paying for somebody else’s medical care, folks, because we ARE ALREADY DOING THAT. Some sort of public insurance has to happen.
Even Alabama has a state program for uninsured/uninsurable citizens. Not having the ability to insure oneself is unacceptable.
Post Script: Halfway thru the program, Pam Stephens came from behind the rostrum to take a seat. I was looking at the Grady CEO, but he did not register anything, maybe he did not see her.
I AGREE!
“This is not an issue about paying for somebody else’s medical care, folks, because we ARE ALREADY DOING THAT. Some sort of public insurance has to happen”.
Don’t we have public “insurance” already? Medicare and medicaid plus all you want in emergency room care.
I don’t think we all want to be on the program, that’s the problem!
You mean like some sort of “public housing” has to occur, John?> Like, a HUD home down the street where the only cost to someone to move in is $100 down?
John…congratulations on moving from “conservatism” to “socialism” in less than 6 months.
We also have the VA.
And you don’t have to be on the public option, but you will have to contribute to it… same as you do now but don’t know it.
No cameras? Why not? Of course we know why not, but what was their explanation?
Perhaps we should search the preamble to the Constitution – according to Hank Johnson that is where Congress is justified to pass Obamacare!!!
Oh yeah and what was funny was when he said that Congress was justified by the preamble of the Constitution and then could not remember what part of the preamble or the words to it and looked at his aide and he looked like – nope not going there – and then he said that it was because the “general welfare” of all people and then rattled on and on for a while longer.
Also, he was laughed at VERY LOUD when he said that Obamacare was deficit neutral and would increase coverage for a lot of people and reduce the cost of healthcare.
Tort reform – something about blah blah Bush’s fault for 8 years, blah blah tort reform has not worked, blah blah if a tree falls from your neighbors yard onto your yard you should be able to sue them which he said was like healthcare???
There were plenty of cameras up front taking pictures of the audience. All through the program people were taking pictures OUT into the crowd.
The protestors all had stickers with the word TAXES and a circle with a strike line through it (No taxes).
Where do you think the real entertainment value was… up on stage or in the rowdy crowd?
@Byte The crowd was largely respectful, typical of the DeKalb I really like. The one row, just behind me, was not entertaining in any way. They were respectful of the guest panel and at times, openly derisive of Cong. Johnson.
Entertainment? This is a serious matter, attended, mostly by serious folks. One of the congressmans’ top aides was upset when the ‘disrupters’ where finally asked to leave– I believe he felt they would gain more notoriety by being escorted out, than if allowed to stay.
But that’s what the “news” organizations want nowadays: conflict, people making fools of themselves, and lots of emotional displays.
I’m glad it wasn’t entertaining enough to end up on The Daily Show. Last night they debated “government-run death panels vs. privately run death panels”.
The Daily Show? Now we now where you’re getting your news.
According to polls, Jon Stewart is more trusted as a news source than anyone else in the news business.
The sentiment is right. He’s the only one out there taking news organizations to task for not standing up to the media-whore BS-ers of the world and calling their misinformation what it is.
As B Balz said, the crowd was generally respectful. at one point I wrote in my pad “this is boring”. Of course the newsies are there to see conflict. You gotta give the people what they want.
It was a good meeting. And a good example of why Johnson should be considered one of the best politicians in the metro area. (And please note I said politician)
And I’m VERY glad the meeting went off as you described. This shouldn’t be theater or “Open Mike Night” at the Angry Store. If people just started to handle it like adults, we might get something out of this that helps solve the problem.
We are Americans. We can do better.
I just watched this on the news, so apparently “no cameras” didn’t apply to the professional press, just to regular folks.
Because God knows those guys lugging those cameras and tripods around aren’t regular folks, and since we have YouTube now we don’t need the press anymore anyway.
I guess they could have made a sign that said “No cameras except with prior permission and valid press credentials”, but then someone would have found some reason to bitch about that too.
As many drugs are dispensed in this country, sometimes I think it’s still not enough.
We need more rational adults like U.S. Sen. Johnny Isakson leading the debate!
“Death panel” architect a pro-life Republican from Georgia?
SS-…..But there is nothing resembling the alleged “death panel” in the health care reform plan. A spokesperson for Palin told ABC News that the former governor was referring to a section promoting advance care planning that appears on page 425 of the House Democrats’ bill [pdf]. Advance care planning includes living wills and durable powers of attorney that allow individuals to make clear their wishes for end-of-life care, whatever they may be.
And as it turns out, the cause of advance planning has been championed especially strongly by a pro-life Republican — U.S. Sen. Johnny Isakson of Georgia.
Isakson (photo above) is a member of Senate Health committee that played a key role in shaping the health care reform legislation. He successfully offered an amendment in committee that allows funds for a government-funded program that provides in-home services to people with disabilities to be used for advance care planning, according to the national Hospice and Palliative Care Organization.
Isakson has been promoting advance care planning for years. In 2007, for example, he co-sponsored two bills to encourage such planning — the Medicare End-of-Life Care Planning Act and the Advance Planning and Compassionate Care Act.
In 2005, Isakson joined with state lawmakers to publicly sign a personal “Directive for Final Health Care” to encourage Georgians to discuss their personal wishes for end-of-life care. He cited the controversial case of Terry Schiavo — a Florida woman who lived for several years in a persistent vegetative state before her husband had her disconnected from a feeding tube — to illustrate the importance of advance planning.
“I believe it is every person’s right and responsibility to make sure their loved ones are prepared to make decisions on their behalf by discussing and documenting their wishes,” Isakson said at the time. “It is my sincere hope that all Georgians will join me in following the lead of the Georgia General Assembly’s Resolution and make their final wishes known…
more
http://controlcongress.com/deficit-spending/death-panel-architect-a-pro-life-republican-from-georgia
Cool John, excellent find!
Hopefully, our GOP will beat enough sense into whatever gets passed so that pragmatic items like Advance Directives are taken into account.
WE are spending $12B per month on the efforts in Iraq/Afghanistan, right or wrong. Our GOP did not get any sort of health industry financing legislation done.
Now the time is upon us, something will happen. Let’s hope it is not too much, to late.
This is what the Democratic Party of Georgia sent out…and John Konop takes it as absolute fact…?
Bill
B Balz is right about the need for “pragmatic items like Advance Directives”. You can be part of the solution or spend your time being angry!
Like we NEEDED a federal law telling us to go get living wills done.
Wowowowowow…
John, you’ve ceased to make any sense. Seriously. You might try moving to Canada and test out their healthcare system for us.
@Bill Simon. You just made The Point, Mr. Simon.
Most folks, and their attorneys don’t know the difference between a Living Will and Advance Directives. In fact, you either mistyped or don’t know the difference between these two documents. They are not the same, though they are often interchanged.
For the record, I think that private insurance companies ought to record and annually update Advance Directives for their policy holders. Either way, walking around without a set of Advance Directives exposes your loved ones to difficult decisions during a tough time.
I honestly hope anyone reading this looks into Advance Directives for themselves and their loved ones. I was given this advice by a good client, and a Medical Records Director.
There is a time when politics MUST take a backseat to clear, pragmatic thinking. I will not critisize your acerbic tone, Sir, but will question your lack of logic.
WE have a public health crisis.
Using the 80/20 rule 80% of health costs occur either for sick babies or end of life hospital encounters.
Bill
You are totally confused! What it does is take the government out of the deal. If you do not make advance arrangements we end up in Terry Shiavo type disputes. It does not make anyone do anything more than just let people know you wishes at end of life. What is wrong with that? Would you rather have lawsuits?
As far as end of life healthcare it is already a wrestling match between you and your insurance company and or Medicare. Do you really think the government should pay ie Medicare for any procedures you want at end of life? Is that being fiscally conservative?
No Bill (he says patiently), we didn’t need a Federal Law telling us to get a living will, but if a Medicare patient asks their doctor about one (and you’re supposed to talk with your doctor about it to make sure your doctor is on board with your desires), the doctor IS NOT PAID for their time for that. The change will get the doctor paid. But you want to twist it into something evil, which says more about you than about the law change.
@ByteMe And you are a bit of-base as well.
Again, (even more patiently) not a Living Will but Advance Directives. here is the difference:
A Living Will is a legal document stating you wishes at a time when you may be unable to do so. It is desgned for use in court. Unfortunately, in real life, hospitals don’t interpret legal documents, so if your Living Will is presented, the hospital may not willing to honor it due to lack of clarity, errors, etc.
Advance Directives are medical in nature, they spell out exactly what your wishes are, so that a doctor knows what to do.
Should you Doc get paid for this? Well, its’ not free, but I don’t think it needs to be coded for payment either. The form is so self-explanatory I don’t see the need to make this another cost center.
I understand what you’re saying, BB, but the big “death panel” nonsense that’s out there is all about a piece of the bill that makes sure that doctors can get paid for discussing a living will with people who want to have them. And talking those documents over with your doctor is imperative if you want to be sure your wishes are followed.
I’m not disagreeing, just coming at it from a different angle. I think having a database of advance directives would be wonderful, like the Do Not Call list with more options. That way, you just need to look up someone’s social security number in the database and the medical practitioners will know exactly what to do even if your doctor isn’t around to help represent you.
Byte,
What happens when someone makes a clerical error in the “life directives” database?
The mechansim for design, deleivery and implementation of Advance Directives ought to be as it is now, for those that have Advance Directives.
The document, that YOU annually review, is available to the Provider from your file. There is no central file, nothing to administer, otherwise the point GaGOP makes could occur.
Let’s not focus on minutia.
You know who else doesn’t want us to focus on the details?
The devil.
Good point.
Clerical error? What happens when there is a clerical error now?
Now the health insurance reform bill has to eliminate clerical errors too?
I will be at Nathan Deal’s townhall meeting in the morning (Wednesday). I’m doubt it will be as eventful as Johnsons.
Make him explain his c4c vote and see if you think it passes the smell test.
I’ll be at Linder’s on Thursday.
I actually got in line to speak at Johnson’s townhall, even though I’m in the 7th. I was going to thank him for co-sponsoring Ron Paul’s “Audit the Fed” bill.
I was there, called to action by Georgia PlannedParenthood. Unfortunately, I was among the many who were left milling about unable to get in. What continues to puzzle me is the number of persons on Medicare, enjoying the benefits of government supplied health care, railing against “socialized medicine”. There is a strong rumor going around that the cabal manipulating the opposition to the proposed health plan have a larger agenda – kill off Medicare and Social Security benefits to seniors. It must be true – I read it on a respected Republican blog.
I was there, called to action by Georgia PlannedParenthood. Unfortunately, I was among the many who were left milling about unable to get in.
You could have walked the line looking for pregnant women to pass your stuff out to…
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Yesterday Goldwater Consevative blamed the entire mess we face on the baby boomer generation. You have discovered our revenge strategy, keep it quiet, though.
LOLOL
http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/104xx/doc10492/08-07-Prevention.pdf
Discusses a CBO analysis of potential savings from preventitive care. It was written at the request of Mr. Nathan Deal, and courtesy copies went to the two “Blue Dogs’ that Cong Johnson dismissed.
Discusses and refutes…
All at the same time?
A poor plan,that if passed will be poorly implemented and result in an absolute failure.
Obama is in way over his head,what a joke.Three hundred acres wide and an inch deep………..
Let’s see what HR3200 ends up looking like after conference
committee, etc. That the AMA, and others, are gathering up behind an unformed HR3200 is noteworthy.
According to Johnson, we can’t discuss the final bill until after they pass it.
Seriously. That’s what he said.
*sigh*
I know Bill, that actually happened and was absurd, The crowd universally boo’ed, and he took a few steps back, indicating he MIGHT have another meeting BEFORE passage.
I doubt it.
Is it possible that he meant until after it gets out of committee and onto the floor where he can actually start to evaluate the bill’s details? Is he on one of the committees handling any of the bills floating around the House? I don’t see his name on the two main committees producing these bills. Maybe he’s just not in a position to do anything about it at this point, but why not just admit that?
These liberal Dems aren’t going to evaluate jack doo-doo. They cannot comprehend what is in the bill for themselves, so they will default to doing WHATEVER Obama wants them to do.
Hank Johnson, Sanford Bishop, & David Scott will ALL vote for whatever Obama tells them to vote for.
Any chatter about any of these folks “examining the final bill” is a LOAD of crappola.
Who wants to bet? Just a simple bet, nothing at stake (because in this state, that would be illegal). I say these 3 will vote for the bill w/o reviewing one page (except for what the DNC’s talking points direct them to look at).
Who wants to bet against me? Byte? Grift?
I would. If you had accepted my similar bet about the Patriot Act.
Grift…I’m becoming an older, middle-aged American. Pardon me if I cannot extract your statement on the Patriot Act from my brain at the moment.
Can you refresh my memory as to:
When you made this statement about the Patriot Act?
What did you say or claim?
Thanks!
I would say the vig is on Bill Simon’s side, Grift.
But that is not a partisan bet. Any newbie rep, GOP or Dem, had better vote pretty much lock step with POTUS, our Party system demands compliance. Anyone going to WDC, ala “Mr. Smith Goes to Washington” as a reformer is deluded. You will be in office exactly ONE term, and nothing will get done.
This is the reality today, and I dislike it intensely, since I cannot imagine any change to the status quo.
Joke, Bill. Remember, it’s all satire.
If it’s “all satire” then shouldn’t you folks be laughing harder at the vids on Scott, along with the swastika being spray-painted on his sign?
Who are these “you folks” you speak of? My imaginary army of leftists?
“Leftists” don’t have armies, dontcha know?
No, but they have unions…which can be called-up and converted to “armies of thugs” in no time flat.
My imaginary army was disbanded after an attempted fragging incident.
It was more of a position of possibly not being able to do anything about it. Getting a politician to admit that is like getting a cat to jump into bathwater. He mentioned it might be a question of timing. Overall it was his worse moment of the night and I think he realized it.
Not all of us are YouTube-Ready, unfortunately. Or maybe fortunately. What would we be like if everyone was ready to be video recorded at all times? Ewww.
BTW, I’m not defending him or his other statements, but wanted to see if this was just navel-gazing or a really important point he was accidentally conveying.
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