Gwinnett Cops can’t read

December 20, 2008 12:47 pm

by Chris · 100 comments

Gwinnett Cops too stupid to read warrant correctly kill the family dog:

A family in Gwinnett County was outraged Wednesday night after they say police officers shot their beloved dog. The homeowners said the incident happened because police went to the wrong house.

[...]

The homeowner said when police went into the garage she heard three shots. The homeowner said an officer told her they shot the dog and the dog ran off.

[...]

Officer said they were looking for a material witness in a gang member’s trial, but they entered the wrong home. Police entered 1468B, instead of 1468A.

Officers said the dog charged and the officer felt he was in imminent danger and shot the dog.

Of course, one might wonder why the hell these thugs with badges were breaking into the garage if they only needed to talk to a witness. But one shouldn’t question police tactics or how many innocent people are killed by incompetent, corrupt or rogue cops. After all they are protecting the children (at least when they aren’t shooting the children).

HT: The Agitator

Dave Bearse December 20, 2008 at 1:37 pm

Is this the same police force that used a no-knock warrant to mistakenly bash in the door of the residence of a man, wife in sleeping baby, and throw the guy to the floor, instead of the intended residence a couple doors away? In that case illiteracy wasn’t any excuse, the intended residence having been under observation by the agency for months.

umustbekidding December 20, 2008 at 2:18 pm

They are only human. Yes, they make mistakes and I am sure the dog owners will sue for millions to help with the ‘pain of their lost”. But to call them “thugs with badges” is a bit much, and the “shooting children” part is over the line.
My brother is a Captain with Dekalb and my brother in law is with Gwinnett Sherriff Dept. (his brother is with Gwinnett Police). All of them are good men and great officers.
It sounds to me like you have some issues, Chris.

umustbekidding December 20, 2008 at 2:32 pm

BTW – if the dog was on a chain or in a cage, like the law requires, it would not have charged the officer and would not have been shot.

Chris December 20, 2008 at 3:02 pm

umust –

The dog was in the f–king garage that the thugs with badges broke into. I’m not gonna keep my dog chained up in my own house just on the off chance come jack-off cop is gonna bust down the door.

Dave Bearse December 20, 2008 at 3:08 pm

UMBK:

You’re right that mistakes happen even with the best training and intention, and I heartily agree with you on the “thugs” comment. It seems the dog was within a garage where chain or cage is not required. You imply it was the owner’s fault (which it wasn’t even if the dogs were in the yard unchained or caged), and that they’ll profit handsomely from it too, neither of which is yet in evidence (but time may tell).

Dave December 20, 2008 at 4:14 pm

UNBK,

Don’t you go blaming the family or excusing the negligent action by a bunch of ignorant cops who can’t even read a GD search warrant correctly. “Thugs” might be too kind a word for these incompetent creeps. I hope they sue your hallowed Dekalb County and the officers individually. Cops like that better learn to do their job correctly or maybe one day they’ll break down the door of a homeowner who is armed and who shoots them in an attempt to defend his family. Tragic possibility? Of course, but nothing will happen to the homeowner in this situation. Especially if the warrant is of the “no knock” variety where the officers just bust in without announcing their presence. Former federal law enforcement here and I have no patience with incompetence among fellow officers.

Tyler December 20, 2008 at 4:27 pm

Officers of the law have a high responsibility, i.e. enforcing the law. There is no room for these kinds of mistakes. I agree completely with ‘Dave’, there is a possibility of an officer getting killed because of “mistakes”. With the power of the law comes a great responsibility. Officers should know what they are doing at all times, NO MISTAKES!

Game Fan December 20, 2008 at 6:00 pm

“My brother is a Captain with Dekalb and my brother in law is with Gwinnett Sherriff Dept. (his brother is with Gwinnett Police). All of them are good men and great officers.”

Which really says nothing whatsoever as to whether there are bad cops or stupid cops.

umustbekidding December 20, 2008 at 8:20 pm

Chris
Was the garage door open? If so, the officers may have been walking up to the house when he saw the dog come towards him. There isn’t enough written about this story. All I was trying to point out is not all police are bad. You obviously have a bad taste for officers. You assume they are all doing something wrong. You weren’t there and you still jump straight into ” thugs with badges were breaking into the garage”.
This is the story from Fox 5

GWINNETT COUNTY, Ga. (MyFOX ATLANTA) – A family in Gwinnett County was outraged Wednesday night after they say police officers shot their beloved dog. The homeowners said the incident happened because police went to the wrong house.
Police were in her drive, homeowner said she heard three shots. Homeowner came outside, homeowner told her they shot the dog and it ran off.
The dog was found dead Wednesday morning at a neighbor’s home
Looking for a gang member wanted by police for felony obstruction was a material witness in a murder trial.
Police said they were given the address of 1468 by the individual wanted by police. Police said there were two free-standing homes located 50 yards apart with the same address.
Homeowner said police went to the wrong home because they had incomplete information.
Officers said the dog charged and the officer felt he was in imminent danger and shot the dog.”

This story says the officer was in the driveway NOT breaking in, as you put it.

Game – They ARE good officers and good men!

El_Capatain December 20, 2008 at 11:39 pm

F the police! 911 is a joke in your town!

Game Fan December 21, 2008 at 6:02 am

Wasn’t sure if you were just talking about the several people you know or super-imposing your own experience onto the entire departments that you mentioned. Because if your trying to say there aren’t a few bad apples, it’s just a little hard to accept.

umustbekidding December 21, 2008 at 6:45 am

Game

I know there are some real @ssholes out there but just because a mistake is make everyone should not rush to burn them at the stake. Honest mistakes do happen.

debbie0040 December 21, 2008 at 8:37 am

When cops are stupid or make honest mistakes, , it usually costs lives. I am sorry but because of their inabilty to read a beloved family dog is dead. They should be fired!!! I would be most interested in the type of dog it was..

If I were that homeowner, I would be calling for them to be fired and raising hell!! It says they entered the wrong home.

“The homeowner said when police went into the garage she heard three shots. The homeowner said an officer told her they shot the dog and the dog ran off.

[...]

Officer said they were looking for a material witness in a gang member’s trial, but they entered the wrong home. Police entered 1468B, instead of 1468A.”

Chris December 21, 2008 at 8:45 am

Debbie

The dog was a vicious dalmatian. Obviously a threat.

umustbekidding December 21, 2008 at 9:03 am

Debbie – you’re reading clips from The Agitator. Google the story to get more info. The story I read said the officers were in the driveway, so the garage must have been open. I hate that it happened. I am a dog lover but that doesn’t make these cops bad.
Chris – you sure do have a lot of hate for the police. Are all cops bad in your eyes or do you just look for the bad in everyone?

debbie0040 December 21, 2008 at 9:58 am

Dalmations are not agressive and the Dalmation was on its property. The police were tresspassing and should be charged with animal cruelty!!

The cops did not exercise due diligance to make sure they were at the correct address. They did not do their job correctly!! They did not feel the need to make sure they were at the correct address and their incompetance put lives at risk. They should not be allowed to continue in law enforcement if their judgement is that bad and they don’t feel the need to follow proper procedure they were taught in law enforcement training.

If they are not fired, then how are we, the public, supposed to feel safe knowing there are such imcompetant police on duty? How can we rest at night not knowing whether or not some over zealous police officer might break down our door thinking they were at a different address? Punishment of these officers needs to be swift and harsh in order to restore the pubublic trust. It does not need to be brushed under the table and it is our duty as citizens to see that it is not.

Make no mistake , as a Gwinnett County citizen, I will be on the phone first thing in the am demanding their badges and I urge others to do the same!!

What if a child was playing with a toy gun? This easily could have been an even greater tragedy!

debbie0040 December 21, 2008 at 1:06 pm

I just watched the video about the incident. The GPD spokesman was very arrogant and acted like his officers did no wrong and he tried to place the blame on the home owners. What an arrogant egotisical a$$.

Made me even angrier. This is the same GPD that jailed someone with Operation Rescue over holiday last year because they had a billboard the GPD found offensive on their truck.

http://www.myfoxatlanta.com/myfox/MyFox/pages/sidebar_video.jsp?contentId=8094786&version=1&locale=EN-US

Game Fan December 21, 2008 at 1:37 pm

umust
I’m not a big fan of the whole “thin blue line” concept. Personally I’d prefer a more “performance based” approach. For example, I think “the first guy through the door” should get a bonus or something. I really think former football players and ex military are top notch. Except for the idiots. You gotta be smart too.

umustbekidding December 21, 2008 at 8:42 pm

Debbie

He was not arrogant, unless that is what you were looking for.

joe December 21, 2008 at 9:37 pm

umustbekidding,

Yes, he was arrogant and egotistical. I don’t live in Gwinnett, and I don’t have any relatives who are cops, so I can look at this with an unbiased viewpoint. Apparently an informer forgot to tell the police that there was an A and a B with the same address. Amazing that the informant told the post office, but failed to tell the police. So the police are at the wrong house, shoot a 2 year old dalmation (by the way, large dogs don’t realy mature until 18-36 months, so this one still had some puppy in him) who is in the middle of eating, and it is the owners fault?
Get real.

debbie0040 December 22, 2008 at 7:41 am

The main phone number for the Gwinnett Police Department is 880 513 5000. I urge everyone to call this number today and complain about the incident. The officers should be charged with animal abuse.

I wonder if the District Attorney or Solictor General can open an investigation into this if they receive enough complaints? It is clear that the Gwinnett PD is just sweeping this under the rug.

Chris December 22, 2008 at 7:58 am

It is clear that the Gwinnett PD is just sweeping this under the rug.

That, UMBK, is the big reason I don’t like cops (as a group). I’m sure some of it is the nature of people who go into that line of work. I’m sure more of it is what happens to people once they do go into that line of work. Really, I place a lot of blame on the ass-hat politicians who want to “get tough on crime” by making everyone criminals then just using a shotgun approach to enforcement.

I don’t think these cops should lose their jobs over this, nor be prosecuted. One to two years of desk assignment is probably enough to send a message of “be more careful”.

Game Fan December 22, 2008 at 8:05 am

The whole “fear of dogs” doesn’t seem like a good combo with police work. Unless you’re behind a desk of course. The gas company can’t have meter readers that are overly afraid of dogs. Why would they hire and train cops that are afraid of dogs?

debbie0040 December 22, 2008 at 8:42 am

I would agree with desk assignment instead of firing, but that likely is not going to happen. In fact, nothing likely will happen if left up to the Gwinnett PD. Just listen to the arrogance of the Public Affairs guy that made the statement. The Gwinnett PD doesn’t see that anything was done wrong by their officers. .

If the officers face criminal charges then they would be forced to re-assign them to desk duty or fire them.

How can the officers be afraid of a Dalamation? They carry pepper spray, why did they not use that? It is clear that they thought they were above the law and could just go around shooting dogs to make a point. I am sorry but they violated the law and should be punished.

Imagine being a law abiding citizen having just fed your beloved family pet. All of a sudden you hear gun fire in your garage and you run outside to find police in your garage and your beloved pet missing. Your pet has never shown aggression toward anyone but the police tell you they felt threatened by your dog and shot him. How would you feel?

The police chose expediency over life in this case and in doing so killed a family pet. If they make bad judgements like that then they are a danger on the streets and they are a danger with that type of authority.

Tinkerhell December 22, 2008 at 8:55 am

Mistakes do happen, but frequency of mistakes with warrants seem to be unacceptably high. No knock warrants shouldn’t exist unless an office an maintain a 100% ratio of good execution of those warrants. That’s already been blown by most places..

Dalmatian – as a breed, are normally very sweet & somewhat shy animals. I personally have met one or two that would happily tear your throat out if they were P.O.ed at you. They are like any other breed – bring em up right & they act right.

I don’t believe the cops. They have OC spray for dogs, not bullets. Particularly one dog. I might can see if a group of strays decided some beat officer had stepped into their turf and they were gonna do something about it. Otherwise – zero reason to shoot at a dog that’s not foaming at the mouth & chewing on some child. Zero.

umustbekidding December 22, 2008 at 9:16 am

Gwinnett county ordinance is:
10-29 – “Dogs must be kept on-leash, restrained, or under control both on and off the owner’s property.”

I don’t agree with the shooting but I am willing to give the officer the benefit of the doubt. Everyone here is inserting their own spin on how this happened;
“thugs with badges were breaking into the garage ”
“the dog was within a garage where chain or cage is not required”
“I am sorry but because of their inabilty to read a beloved family dog is dead. ”

The article did not say the dog was in the garage, it said the owner “heard shots from the garage”. It was open, the officer never broke in. The officer was going to a possible gang members house. He may have had his gun drawn already when the dog ran at him. If you have your gun out, you don’t put it back to pull out the almighty pepper spray!
The Gwinnett spokesman states that there was only an address, no A or B listed. The houses were not marked either. The officer could read, it was the lack of writing that was the problem.

If you want to blame the officer, fine. I am going to give him a chance to explain what happened before I burn him at the stake with the rest of you.

Just Some Thoughts December 22, 2008 at 9:28 am

So hear are my thoughts
Where are the Senators and Representatives from Gwinnett calling for someone’s head. The GOP needs to start cleaning its own house

And why hasn’t there been a single comment from the county commission or the chairman? This is a police chief who works at the pleasure of the commission.

We all laugh at Vincent Fort for his stunts to get on the TV and we should. But when mistakes are costing lives, thankfully this time it was a dog and not an old lady, or citizens are being held at gunpoint by the same group and the GOP sits on their collective hands it is a tacit approval of this behavior. This is why the GOP is becoming a joke.

A conservative should stand up and say enough is enough. If you party folks who wear the banner as a cloak to hide your cowardice won’t stand up to those putting citizens at risk then you need not serve. The time for that kind of mamby pamby leadership is over. It is time conservatives step up, call it as it is, and take the party back to where it belongs, WITH and FOR the CITIZENS.

debbie0040 December 22, 2008 at 10:11 am

According to what I read, the homeowner had the dog in the garage. The door was probably closed and the police with their no knock warrant opened the door, startled the dog and the dog started running outside like most dogs do when they have a chance at escape. The police panicked and shot the dog. Again they exercised poor judgement and should not be on the street. Why on earth would the owner keep a Dalamation in an open garage door? They knew the dog would escape. Does not make sense. The Police are just trying to cover their butts.

No where in the article does it say the garage was opened. Tell me, umbk, do you work for the Gwinnett PD or know someone that does? You are trying to justify the shooting by siting that ordiance. Do think the Gwinnett PD should go around shooting dogs that are off the leash or running free?

Keep in mind, they were just to question a material witness, not arrest a violent fugitive.

umustbekidding December 22, 2008 at 10:37 am

Debbie

Look at the video – the garage is open, she might be one of those people who always leaves it open. You sure do read a lot into this. There was nothing written about opening the garage or breaking in.
And, yes, they were there to question a material witness, not arrest a violent fugitive but it was a witness in a GANG trial. They should be cautious because that person could be a gang member or maybe there could be other gang members there, PO’d that their friend is on trail. You just don’t know.

No, I do not work for the GPD. Yes, I do know polenty of officers but not the one here.

Just Some Thoughts December 22, 2008 at 10:40 am

UMBK
This would not be so bad had it not been just a couple of weeks ago that the same group of fools burst into the wrong house and held a family and young child at gun point. Certainly mistakes happen but when they seem to be continuous then you must look at the leadership and wonder why they are still there. These men while probably very honorable, had poor leadership, poor training, poor planning and poor execution. I think even you must be able to see that.

umustbekidding December 22, 2008 at 10:46 am

Just some thought – you are right. I agree with you.
I just think some are jumping to conclusions. They are ready to throw the officer in jail and throw away the key.

Dave December 22, 2008 at 12:07 pm

The home owners need to call the cops and report this incident as if a normal person had shot the dog. The police will have to file a report on their own officers. How about an allegation of criminal trespass and the commission of a crime while in possession of a firearm? Since they were not on the correct property, they were not lawfully there. In the performance of their duties you say? Who gives a s**t, file the charge anyway. How about animal cruelty? The homeowners could stir the pot a little and make Dekalb PD’s life miserable. Where is the ASPCA on this? Make them aware of it and let the animal advocates get involved. And finally, get the best lawyer you can who specializes in suing cops and unleash him on these idiots.

debbie0040 December 22, 2008 at 12:11 pm

Dave, it happened in Gwinnett County.

UMBK, The garage door was probably opened because the news media was doing a news story on the fact the dog was being fed in the garage. You give FAR TOO much benefit of a doubt to the PD. I did send the story to different animal activist groups to stir up the pot!!!

umustbekidding December 22, 2008 at 12:14 pm

good for you

Dave December 22, 2008 at 12:15 pm

Sorry, Deb. You are correct!

Icarus December 22, 2008 at 12:17 pm

Have none of you put on your tinfoil hats this morning?

The police killed a Dalmation. Dalmations are known far and wide as the mascot of the fire department.

With local governments facing budget cuts across the board, this is nothing more than a literal shot across the bow from the police to the fire department about who they expect to take the larger share of the cuts.

Case closed.

debbie0040 December 22, 2008 at 12:20 pm

I think a thorough investigation needs to be done by law enforecment other than the Gwinnett PD. It is clear that the Gwinnett PD is trying to just sweep this under the rug and hopes it just fades away. If the animal cruelty law was broken then they need to be prosecuted.

Dave December 22, 2008 at 12:25 pm

Send in the GBI for an independent review. The cops screwed up in the fact that they killed a family pet. Although misguided, these days folks care far more about animal abuse and cruelty than they do these types of acts done on people. This issue is far from over,

umustbekidding December 22, 2008 at 12:30 pm

Dave – The police were at the right address, there were to houses there, A and B. Neither marked! That is not trespassing.

What about the leash law? Should that be ignored?
Believe it or not, dalmations have attacked. Look it up.

umustbekidding December 22, 2008 at 12:32 pm

“Two houses” – it should read

Game Fan December 22, 2008 at 12:40 pm

If conservatives are going to be outraged by job security in the UAW, then why not show the same concern with police? Sure they’re going to close ranks around their co-workers. And the best cops are least likely to rat out their partner, even if they’re an idiot. It would be bad for morale. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esprit_de_corps
But privately, they may not like working alongside a “quickdraw canine killa”.

Dave December 22, 2008 at 12:40 pm

Sorry, UMBK, they were not at the correct address. A, B, C or D. Who cares? They got it wrong. That part has already been admitted. But you go on defending the negligent acts of your police buddies. Leash law, schmeash law. It could be argued and successfully so in front of a sympathetic jury, that the dog was defending it’s territory. My bet is that the dog’s behavior wasn’t aggressive in the least, rather it was running toward the officer in order to receive attention. This highly trained officer of the law, this real-life David Caruso, probably crapped his pants and even though he was of Gwinnett’s Finest, overreacted and shot the poor animal. Let’s let a civil jury decide if that was negligent behavior. I’m betting on a rather large civil judgment in favor of the family.

Game Fan December 22, 2008 at 12:48 pm

Aren’t some Dalmations deaf or is this just an urban legend? If he/she were deaf, this would explain the canine’s failure to comply with the officer’s command:

“Lay down on the floor and put your paws behind your back.”

debbie0040 December 22, 2008 at 1:31 pm

UMBK, you are really grasping at straws tryint to defend your buddies in the Gwinnett PD. Leash law? The Dalmation was secured in the garage until your Police buddies opened the garage door.

As far as civil penalties, if I am not mistaken, loss of a pet carries very minimal financial recovery in a civil case. I don’t believe the owner would be eligible for pain and suffering.

Dave, I do agree with your assessment of the event. Barney Fife comes to mind when I think of these cops that shot the dog…

debbie0040 December 22, 2008 at 1:34 pm

I used to do animal rescue and fostered a Dalamation for a few months until a home could be found for her.

She was the most docile dog and got along with my cats. The thought of some Barney Fife cop shooting one because they could infuriates me…

Dave December 22, 2008 at 1:37 pm

Deb,
What I would be counting on if I took this case in front of a jury would be their desire to punish the cops for sheer stupidity and dole out a ton of money for pain and suffering. We both might be surprised at their generosity. We’d have to make sure UMBK didn’t try and sneak on the jury like the anti-death penalty folks did on the Nichols case. LOL!

Game Fan December 22, 2008 at 2:00 pm

The Chance of success may be “spotty” at best. But that’s no reason to lay down and roll over.

debbie0040 December 22, 2008 at 2:24 pm

I thought that Georgia Law severely limits the award for animals and for pain and suffering for loss of an animal. Any lawyers care to comment?

Tinkerhell December 22, 2008 at 3:47 pm

I’ll see your spotty and raise you:

I can think of “101” different reasons why a jury would be sympathic to this kind of a civil case.

blazer December 22, 2008 at 4:39 pm

I’ll preface this by saying that I am a Police officer…

I hate when people Monday morning quarterback an officer’s action based on a small incomplete and quite often inaccurate news report. It too often is biased, intentionally trying to make the officer look negligent or make his actions criminal.

I hate it for the family and their dog. Its truly terrible. However, as for me and my fellow officers; We are going home at 6 o clock.

I will give this opinion based on the information that we’ve all seen. It appears that the officers were checking the residence for a wanted person who was also a witness to another crime. It sounds that the residence was a duplex or apartment style residence. It is very possible that the building was not marked except for the house number. In my jurisdiction, we are doing good if one or two houses per street are numbered; even better if they are numbered correctly. Btw, if the dog charged the officers, by all means do what is necessary to defend himself and the other officers because like I already said, we are going home at 6.

umustbekidding December 22, 2008 at 5:25 pm

Blazer
Thank god, a reasonable person who happens to be an officer. Watch out, there are a bunch of cop haters on here.

Debbie, if they don’t get enough money in there law suit, maybe they can sue the gun dealer or better yet, the manufacture. Would that make you feel better?

Chris December 22, 2008 at 7:32 pm

Yup, you get to go home at 6 o’clock and to hell with the damage caused to everyone else.

umustbekidding December 22, 2008 at 8:07 pm

Chris
Are you sure it’s not the gun’s fault?

Dave December 22, 2008 at 10:13 pm

No reasonable person sues a gun manufacturer because of the way their product was handled. Of course folks do it all the time anyway. I assume everyone remembers Columbine. But why try to marginalize the loss the family has suffered by going to the absurd? I have a feeling that once the facts are known, these guys will not only go home AT 6, they’ll be suspended FOR 6 as well, weeks that is.

Game Fan December 22, 2008 at 10:54 pm

blazer
First…
“I hate when people Monday morning quarterback an officer’s action based on a small incomplete and quite often inaccurate news report.”
Then…
“I will give this opinion based on the information that we’ve all seen.”

You may be a good cop but a Perry Mason you’re not. :)

Bill Simon December 22, 2008 at 11:58 pm

UMust,

You said this (repeatedly, I might add): What about the leash law? Should that be ignored?

Here’s the matter at hand: There is a leash law. But, YOUR interpretation of it is that if the police want to enter your property, they have more rights than you do…and, in effect, it becomes no longer YOUR property, but the government’s.

That is what your line of comments appears to be pointing to. That is that we actually live in a police state and if the police bust into a garage, every living thing in that household must immediately hit the ground and cower at the mere sight of blue uniforms.

Bill Simon December 23, 2008 at 12:00 am

Blazer,

You said this: Btw, if the dog charged the officers, by all means do what is necessary to defend himself and the other officers because like I already said, we are going home at 6.

And, what if a 10 year-old child “charged” the officers while waving a baseball bat ? Shoot the kid too?

umustbekidding December 23, 2008 at 6:53 am

Bill, I mentioned the leash law b/c of people were picking the laws they wanted inforced. Like:

“”How about an allegation of criminal trespass and the commission of a crime while in possession of a firearm? Since they were not on the correct property, they were not lawfully there. In the performance of their duties you say? Who gives a s**t, file the charge anyway. How about animal cruelty?””

Plus, accused them of breaking in. It doesn’t say the broke in anywhere.
I did not say that it was right, just give the police a chance. Yes, some do things wrong but not always. We need more information before we hang him.
Norcross is a bad area with a lot of crime and gangs. Maybe that’s why he had his gun out. WE DON’T KNOW.

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 7:19 am

No knock warrants should be used with discretion and the officers should make sure they are at the correct location. The Dalmation was in the garage with the door closed and when the Barney Fife cops opened the door the dog dashed out in his escape. The cops panicked and shot the dog. I am sorry but police officers have a great deal of power and authority and those involved with this incident should not be on the street if they exercise that bad judgement. They killed a beloved family pet.

This is the second time Gwinnett Police have broken into the wrong home in ten days. I am sorry but obviously the GPD officers are not being given proper training. They routinely trample on property rights without punishment. Changes need to occur at the top….

The GPD spokesman had a very cavalier attitude and it was clear it was being swept under the rug. The police had their chance and blew it. They just want it to go away and the spokesman made that clear. I emailed animal rescue groups the story and also posted it on Craig’s List so this will not go away or be swept under the rug.

Blazer, you just proved that the Police cover up for their own. You would be defending police actions even if a child were killed.

A Dalmation is not vicious. They should have use pepper spray but they did not. If a officer is afraid of a gentle Dalmation, then they should not be on a gang task force.

umustbekidding December 23, 2008 at 7:38 am

Debbie
Why don’t you contact the police and find out how this happened first?

And how do you know the garage door was closed? That was not mentioned anywhere.

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 8:22 am

“And how do you know the garage door was closed? That was not mentioned anywhere” It was not mentioned anywhere that it was opened either. It is logical that the door was closed. The dog was eating and the homeowners would not have just left the garage door open for the dog to run off.

I know Dalmations are not vicious dogs. I know the GPD did not use due dilligence when exercising a no knock warrant. I know that ten days ago they went to the wrong address on a no knock warrant.

As far as contacting the police, I have called and complained about the incident. The Gwinnett PD made their position clear in the statement issued by their communications person. He came across as arrogant and put the blame on the homeowners.

An officer that exercises as bad judgement as that officer that shot the dog should not be on the street.

blazer December 23, 2008 at 9:08 am

Bill Simon,

Obviously a 10 year old child would not be a threat for charging you. If you add a pistol in the hands of a ten year old child or a butcher knife at close range then obviously it would be a threat.

Basically, a human being is not automatically a deadly force threat however a dog is…

blazer December 23, 2008 at 9:19 am

Debbie,

Anyone who makes a blanket statement that a certain breed of dog is not vicious obviously needs to pull their head out of the ground. I own a Black Lab, not a “vicous breed,” but I’ve been bitten by my own dog before.

Game Fan December 23, 2008 at 9:23 am

A dog is automatically a deadly force threat? How about a teacup Yorkshire?
http://tinyurl.com/5swwu2

Scriven December 23, 2008 at 10:00 am

I normally come down on the side of police enforcement, because they take on a difficult job and do it to the best of their ability. However, there seems to be a systematic problem here that could easily be solved with a few additions to the SOP.

In the case of the GCPD breaking into the wrong house on Spring Valley Drive two simple things could have prevented that mistake. It’s clear that someone in the department had that house under surveillance for a period of time, but no one involved in the surveillance detail was present when the warrant was served. If someone for the detail was there they probably would have pointed out they were breaking into the wrong house. If they were there and still broke into the wrong house they should be fired. The other thing that would have solved this is if someone would have included a picture of the house in the warrant packet.

As far as the home on Pirkle road, a casual glance at the property would have shown two mail boxes. They’re visible from the road. That should have tipped off police that they didn’t have enough information to execute a warrant, but maybe they didn’t care because their shift ended at 11 a.m. and they wanted to “Go home at 6 p.m.”

I’m all for supporting the police, but its pretty clear there are either systemic problems in the GCPD system, or several officers weren’t paying close enough attention to their duties and should be punished accordingly.

Bill Simon December 23, 2008 at 10:19 am

Blazer,

A 10 year-old wielding a baseball bat running at you swinging it cannot be any less of a threat than a barking dog running at you. A dog is much lower to the ground.

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 10:20 am

I have two Chihuahuas and I bet the police would have shot them had they trespassed on my property by mistake. The police did not exercise due dilligance in doing their job because they knew they would not be punished for it. There were other ways the police should have handled the situation. They had guns drawn and should have waited to see if the dog attacked them and they then could have shot him. But no, they did not. They were pretty trigger happy and felt they could get away with it.

I usually support the Police but in this they were wrong. What made matters much was the fact, the GPD spokesman was not apologetic at all. He was arrogant and tried to place the blame on the home owners… It underlines the arrogant attitude of the Gwinnett PD…

Bill Simon December 23, 2008 at 10:21 am

Blazer,

So, if you were walking down a street, not on duty, and a dog appeared barking and snarling at you, would you just pull out a gun and shoot it dead?

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 10:25 am

The Yellow Jackets killed a bunch of bulldogs Thanksgiving weekend…

Icarus December 23, 2008 at 10:29 am

The police clearly screwed up here, but I am somewhat amazed (though I probably shouldn’t be) at the tone of the indignation here.

I honestly think several of you would prefer the policeman were dead instead of the dalmation.

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 10:40 am

UMBK, just for the record, I am not a cop hater. I will not turn a blind eye when they do something wrong either as you do. Some in the blue brotherhood supports police no matter what they do. My neighbor is a 15 year veteran of the Atlanta PD and he will tell you that I am not a cop hater. He had problems with what happened. There are many great cops out there, but unfornately the behaviour of a few sometimes taint the good cops. It does not help matters that the Gwinnett PD just tries to sweep these incidents under the rug and people like you come to the defense when they are clearly in the wrong.

It is tough being a cop, but police should be held to a higher standard because of the authority they hold. Some get into police work to protect and serve and a few get into police work because they have a “god” complex..

In this case, they were wrong. They were wrong ten days prior when they broke into a wrong house while excuting a no knock warrant.

If proper action had taken after that incident ten days ago, this second incident would have never happened because new guidelines and procedures would have been put in place for no knock warrants. As I said, there is clearly a problem with leadership at the top in the Gwinnett PD…

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 10:45 am

The indignation here is over the fact the Gwinnett PD screwed up and then tried to blame it on the property owners instead of acknowledging they were wrong and screwed up. They used a no knock warrant improperly by not making sure they were at the right house. The same thing happened again ten days prior. The police are supposed to protect us, but who is supposed to protect us from incompetent police?

Icarus December 23, 2008 at 10:46 am

The dalmation I guess. But he’s dead.

umustbekidding December 23, 2008 at 11:10 am

Debbie – I don’t think this was a no-knock warrant.
I called the GPD this morning to get a copy of the report but it has not been entered into the system yet.
If the officer broke in, opened the garage, or it turns out he shot a dog that was not showing his teeth while jumping towards him, I’ll admit I was wrong and the officer should be fired. But if there is good reason then I hope you will change your mind.
I am just giving him the benefit of the doubt, you already have him executed.

Game Fan December 23, 2008 at 11:19 am

Icarus
If you think this is really just about a Dalmation then you’re an idiot.

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 11:22 am

I hope you make your judgement on other factors than the police report. Do you really think anything derogatory about the police will be in it?

As far as bearing their teeth, I have two Chihuahuas that bear their teeth when they bark. Do they deserve to be shot ?

It is hard to give the benefit of the doubt when the GPD communications officer came across as arrogant as he did by putting the blame on the home owners and acting as if they did nothing wrong. The controversary over this could have been avoided if it had been handled properly by the Gwinnett PD.

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 11:24 am

Today a Dalamation, tomorrow a child … It is over property rights and the conduct of the police. I would have been screaming if the dog was not killed.
You should not have to worry about the Police coming on to your private property by mistake…

Icarus December 23, 2008 at 11:33 am

Game Fan,

I think I can prove I’m an idiot without the help of a dalmation.

Game Fan December 23, 2008 at 11:39 am

I did say “If”. I hope you’re not that shallow. Here’s something to ponder. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macrocosm_and_microcosm

umustbekidding December 23, 2008 at 11:40 am

Debbie, A little dog is much different than a 70 – 80 lbs. dog.

Icarus December 23, 2008 at 11:44 am

I can do shallow, too.

It helps when dating blonde YRs.

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 11:45 am

http://www.theagitator.com/2008/12/20/dead-dog-tales/#comment-221561

#20 | Kathleen | December 22nd, 2008 at 9:57 pm
I am the owner of the dog that got shot. My dog was not a mean dog. He would have never charged at anyone. I was in my kitchen when the incident happened, my dog did not bark or grawl. All that was herd was three gun shots. Yes three gun shots. Two of which put two bullet holes into my house. I dont see why firing three shots at my dog was proper prdocedure. They could of maced, or tasered, or shot up in the air to startle the dog or bring awarness to me that they were there and needing assitance. They took away a family member in our house. he wasnt just a dog, he was our family. my kids are heart broken, and I feel like i lost one of my kids. I would hope that all dog owners will unite and help me defend Kalu’s legacy so this never happens again

rugby fan December 23, 2008 at 12:22 pm

Andre vs. Decaturguy is better than everyone in the world vs. umustbekidding.

umustbekidding December 23, 2008 at 1:53 pm

It doesn’t bother me if this group is against me. Debbie has her mind made up that no matter what happened, the officer was wrong. So, facts don’t matter. There is very little anyone actually knows about this situation. Most of the crap written here is speculation.

I feel bad for the owner but I am not going on a witch hunt like the rest of you. I’ll wait for the full story.

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 8:17 pm

Facts do matter and I would love a thorough investigation but Gwinnett PD has made it clear they will not do one. I think the Gwinnett County Commission should investigate this as they appoint the Gwinnett Police Chief. I don’t know how much sway they would have, but I find it hard to believe that Commissioners like Mike Beaudrieu and others would put up with this type of disregard for proper procedure if that is what the investigation finds..

Will it take a tragedy like Kathryn Johnson in Gwinnett for procedures to change?

The Gwinnett PD spokesman should have acknowledged they made a mistake and that it was unforgiveable that this happened twice in ten days. He should have stated that the Gwinnett PD was immediately reviewing and revising procedures to make sure this infrigement on personal property rights did not happen again. Then they should have discipline the officers involved.

debbie0040 December 23, 2008 at 8:22 pm

I strongly disagreed with the Commisson on the trash fiasco, but Commissioners Beaudrieau and Nasui have changed their mind on the trash plan. They found it is never too late to do the right thing.

That is why I think they should be informed about this incident as they would investigate and would not stand for it if the facts are procedure was not followed and the wrong house was invaded.

Bill Simon December 23, 2008 at 10:08 pm

Did the GPD EVER get their witness? You know, the thing they were originally after?

blazer December 23, 2008 at 10:39 pm

Bill Simon,

I would be more likely to shoot a snarling and charging dog off duty rather than on duty simply because that would be the only option I had. Personally, my first choice would be pepper spray; but the force continuum is different for different agencies and officers…

Bill Simon December 23, 2008 at 10:53 pm

blazer,

Well, don’t visit me, okay? I have a snarling and charging Yellow Lab who acts tough but wouldn’t do anything against a human being. It’s just the way he responds to unfamiliar people.

umustbekidding December 24, 2008 at 8:26 am

Bill

So, your lab likes to pretend he’s tough. Mine can’t even pretend. He is a 95 lbs wimp. He loves anyone who will pet him. (And believe me he gets enough loving from us but he’s always ready for a little more)

Chris December 24, 2008 at 8:54 am

Debbie – do you have a link to Beaudrieau and Nasui changing their position?

I’ve had respect for Beaudrieau till this trash thing came along.

Game Fan December 24, 2008 at 9:35 am

umustbekidding
When something goes wrong, there should be some accountability. That’s all. Same for any state, local or Federal agency. Including law enforcement and military. The ATF, the FBI, Centcom, FEMA, anything. If you haven’t noticed a certain change in the roll between the public and law enforcement/military/politicians over the last 20 or so years you haven’t been paying attention.

umustbekidding December 24, 2008 at 9:45 am

Game
I agree but let’s not hang him before he has a chance to explain things. I hate that the officer has not spoken about this. I am sure he is being told not to.

About the change – Obama’s Civilian Security Force scares me the most. That would put us in a police state. With all that is happening right now people are blind to the power the politicians have and the power they are taking from us.

Game Fan December 24, 2008 at 9:55 am

umustbekidding
I agree but the only thing wrong with the “no outrage” concept is nothing happens when nobody gets mad. And Police Chiefs are usually the worst. More like politicians usually. Anti-gun many times.

Game Fan December 24, 2008 at 10:13 am

blazer
Wouldn’t you be a little relieved if you had a fellow officer who was less than competent and they were relieved of duty? (I’m not saying this is the case here, I’m just saying)

Dave December 24, 2008 at 3:02 pm

This isn’t GA related but the accountability factor needs to always be in place. The Blackwater protective agents who were involved in the September 07 shooting in Iraq where 18 or so folks were killed are in a world of hurt. A handful were just indicted a few weeks back. It will be interesting to see where this case goes.

Game Fan December 24, 2008 at 3:16 pm

Here’s a new police training vid. that’s being utilized by police forces in some areas in order to avoid this type of problem in the future.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtlODX1Ba0M

debbie0040 December 24, 2008 at 5:49 pm

Chris, I saw a news article in eithe the AJC or Gwinnett Daily post written about the court order. Both Beaudrieu and Nasui stated they had problems with the trash plan after hearing from the people. Beaudrieu also spoke about the recyling plan and stated he had issues with the trash gestapo..

debbie0040 December 24, 2008 at 5:51 pm

I have two Chihuahuas that think they are Rottweilers..

Chris December 24, 2008 at 8:21 pm

Debbie – Our dog and my mother-in-law’s dog (Chihuahuas) are most vicious beasts. I’ve thought about putting them in a pen and selling tickets, but I read somewhere that wasn’t legal.

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