1. John Konop says:


    How can Fred stay in if he gets less than 5% of the vote? The money will dry up! And Fred is not a grass roots door to door type candidate. He could get back on Law and Order before the writers

  2. Jace Walden says:


    I have read similar reports that Fred! had changed his strategy to focus on winning the Southern States.

    But I have similar reservations regarding the likelyhood of this. His support in Southern States is evaporating, fast. Huckabee is now ahead of him here and in South Carolina–two former Thompson strongholds.

    There is also speculation that he’ll pull out after New Hampshire and endorse John McCain. At this point, I think this is the most likely scenario.

  3. GOPeach says:

    My thought is ….

    It’s hard to work hard for someone who says fire in the belly is not needed on the campaign trail.

    Fred-heads are tired of working for “the man” who is soooooooooooooo laaaaaaaaaaaaaaaid back.

  4. Jace Walden says:

    I honestly hate this though. Fred Thompson had one of the better fiscal/small-government records of any of the other candidates, save Ron Paul. I was excited about Fred entering the race…I even signed up for the GA4Fred thingy.

    Fred’s best day in this entire campaign was the day before he announced his candidacy. He has been quite a disappointment since then. Although he was never my first choice, I had high hopes for him being a reasonable alternative if Ron Paul loses.

    Fred has been such a dud. One of my friend’s sister worked for Fred’s Senate Campaign in Tennessee. She said that he is the laziest person in politics. Looks like she’s right.

  5. juliobarrios says:


    I agree, other then Ron Paul, Thompson seems to be one of the few willing to discuss the problem of runaway entitlements. It’s a losing campaign strategy in this country, people don’t want to hear reality, they want to hear about free college and retirement checks.

  6. Bill Simon says:

    The only poll that matters is the poll on Election Day.

    Anything else is just fodder for a bunch of talking heads (or, yapping “bloggers”) to have something to talk about so they can feel important in their world.

  7. liberator says:

    If Ron Paul isn’t the GOP Nominee then Hillary will win the Presidency. The other candidates don’t excite anybody nor are they for less government or more personal liberty.

  8. Paul Shuford says:

    Fred Thompson’s campaign is so lazy that they’ve now failed to turn in the paperwork with the 298 signatures necessary to get ballot access in D.C. The District of Columbia doesn’t even check the validity of the signatures, so all they would have had to do is put 298 names on the paperwork and turn the sheets in.

    I hate to say it, you Thompson supporters are really, really betting on the wrong horse. It’s time you admitted it and find a candidate that gives a damn.

  9. BubbaRich says:

    At least Ron Paul is beating somebody!

    It’s too bad that they let other people vote, because the people with spare millions laying around would obviously elect him in a second. Maybe we should use some other method to elect a president, like “biggest fund raising day.”

    Paul did, at least, figure out not to talk about the things that make him sound craziest, at least I haven’t heard much about them on the campaign trail. Maybe he doesn’t have a press corps, though.

  10. Hank Reardan says:

    Bubba rich
    Are you hating on rich people?
    I believe Ron Paul’s numbers would be even higher if they included the Libertarians( and some democrats) who are going to cross over and vote in the republican primary. I believe I heard he has only been to Iowa one time this year.

  11. debbie0040 says:

    Bill Simon is right. How many times have pollsters been way off? If pre election polls were right, why even have elections?

    I can remember the 2000 Presidential Election being called by the networks for Al Gore. They were going by their exit polling data. Polls taken even on election day were wrong. The 2004 election pre elections polls showed Kerry defeating Bush.

    The polls in the recent Lt. Governor’s race showed Reed defeating Cagle handily..

    This time in 1979, people were criticizing Reagan’s campaigning style. Bush 41 looked like he would easily defeat Reagan. Reagan excelled when his back was against the wall and Thompson is the same way.

    Thompson is Conservative, Thompson is Presidential
    The Impending Thompson Surge

    ENPR: Fred Thompson is the ‘X factor’ in Iowa


  12. Jace Walden says:


    The poll you cited is old. The one I posted is more recent, and I can show you another that’s more recent if you want. Fred is going nowhere. His campaign is stagnant.

    Bill Simon,

    I agree with you. It’s just hard to see how a guy can rebound from being in single digits to pulling off an upset in 8 days.

    Paul has been in single digits the entire campaign…and anytime a Paul supporter, like me, says that Paul is going to win, everyone reminds me that he’s polling in the single digits.

    The only difference between Fred! and Paul now is that Fred won’t have the cross overs to boost his poll numbers. He’s dead in the water and you know it.

  13. Jace Walden says:

    And I would like to reiterate that I wish he wasn’t dead in the water. He had a great record compared to everyone except Ron Paul. He would have made an excellent candidate to fall back on.

    Unfortunately, his best day was the day before he announced. Anyone with a brain can see that his campaign has been going down ever since.

  14. Warrior says:

    Fred has worked hard since last debate in Iowa. He is positioned to capitalize on a fade by Huckabee once they figure out what a phony he is. If not, Fred is probably out. Forget polls – especially in Iowa.

  15. Horace says:

    Honest to goodness, why doesn’t McCain get the GOP excited? He’s a genuine hero, principled to a fault, would almost certainly cut spending, etc., etc.
    I have to admit, though, I wasn’t so high on him until I gave a gander to the rest of the GOP field. I think he’ll catch fire soon.

  16. NonPartisanGA says:

    Does anyone take issue with Ron Paul’s statements about African Americans:

    Writing in his independent political newsletter in 1992, Paul commented about black men in the nation’s capital.

    Citing statistics from a 1992 study produced by the National Center on Incarceration and Alternatives, a criminal justice think tank based in Virginia, Paul concluded in his column:

    “Given the inefficiencies of what DC laughingly calls the criminal justice system, I think we can safely assume that 95 percent of the black males in that city are semi-criminal or entirely criminal.”

    “These aren’t my figures,” Paul said this week. “That is the assumption you can gather from” the report.

    He also wrote: “Opinion polls consistently show that only about 5 percent of blacks have sensible political opinions, i.e. support the free market, individual liberty and the end of welfare and affirmative action.”

    Paul continued that politically sensible blacks are outnumbered “as decent people.”


  17. debbie0040 says:

    I am not counting Fred out just yet. Yes, I am disappointed in his campaign since his announcement but I still believe he can have a third place showing in Iowa.

    In this campaign season, you just never know what will happen next.

    There is hope that Fred will continue to work hard.

    From Rasmussen Reports:
    Thompson is now viewed favorably by 67% of Republican voters, McCain and Giuliani by 65%, Huckabee by 64%, and Romney by 59%. Among all voters, McCain has the highest favorability ratings of any candidate in either party

  18. BubbaRich says:


    No, I ain’t hatin’ on rich people.

    And most of the polls make the appropriate allowances for whatever primary/caucus you plan to vote in. Does Iowa allow crossover voting the day of the caucus? It varies state to state, but in many places you have to register to vote in that party a few weeks before the primary/caucus.

    I’ve got no idea how to vote, myself. I think I’m registered as a Democrat in Georgia, but most of them are “don’t cares” for me, with Bill Richardson potentially interesting, but I don’t know anything about his positions on issues. McCain is the main candidate I’d support, but Georgia Republicans seem to be running away from him towards a more (Paul) or less (Huckabee) insane candidate.

  19. Hank Reardan says:

    we do not register by party in Georgia. No one is a register democrat or Republican or Libertarian. I believe what are doing in these polls they are calling likey voters. If you have never cross voted or in some state justed changed how you are registered you would not be considered a likey voter for that primary in that party. So you are less likely to be polled. BTW did anyone see the big Ron Paul billboard on I-20. A new one is going up next week in Gwinnet on I-85.

  20. JonHodges says:

    I think Fred is not really interested in the job. I view him as apathetic to the whole process, and who can really blame him. I think originally he would have had a good chance at it if he could have created the fervor of the Paul campaign. I think someone else got it right, Fred is going to drop out and endorse McCain. Big disappointment for the GOP, but losing to Paul will be the end of his campaign.
    Bubba Rich, In Iowa you can register and vote on the same day. They have walk up registration, so even though it is technically a closed primary, if you want to switch parties on Jan 3, you can.

  21. StevePerkins says:

    I don’t know if you can talk about Ron Paul supporters as being rich people with “lots of millions to throw around”. The average Paul donor has contributed somewhere between $50 to $100. The man draws cash, but you can’t say that he’s in the pocket of wealthy interests. He just has grassroots support that really does support the man… as opposed to the Huckabee people who were Fred-heads yesterday and may end up polling for someone else tomorrow.

    Oh, and not even bothering to turn in 298 signatures to get on the ballot in D.C.?!? C’mon Fred people… that’s nothing short of political malpractice.

  22. GOPeach says:


    That Strategic Vision link must be a little dated because Tom Tancredo dropped out….

    In politics… 5 minutes is “dated”. 🙂

  23. GOPeach says:

    I wonder how many of these guys will drop out and back McCain? How many will back Romney?

    I do not see any establishment types backing Ron Paul or Mike Huckabee…. They will have to pull their own weight – This should get interesting.

    I think Duncan Hunter will drop out next…. I really like him. ( so does Ann Coulter).

  24. Still Looking says:

    Paul made a fairly good showing on Meet the Press, until he started talking about the Civil War. The he reminded everyone that from time to time he wears a tinfoil hat.

  25. JonHodges says:

    Still Looking,
    So you would agree that the death of over 600,000 men in the Civil war was a good idea?

    Have you read much on the subject?

  26. Been vacationing in Connecticut. From the folks I talk with, they’re not too keen on Romney. They don’t seem to recognize him as a New Englander, which really came as a surprise.

    What I am seeing is a warming to Huckabee. They are seeing through the political rhetoric and realize the man worked effectively for his state. Money doesn’t grow on trees, and he’s not afraid to talk straight with the people.

    From Romney’s “lifelong hunter” fabrication, his comments about his father marching with MLK, although he really didn’t march with MLK (just in his heart) to strapping his dog on the top of his car for a 12 hour road trip, they feel he’s rich but lacks any credibility or common sense.

    Fred is a good and decent man. Its unfortunate that his numbers have been flat. I do think its fair to consider that it wasn’t even six months ago that he disclosed he had a health crisis. That weighs on people. I do think if anyone, outside of Huckabee, that has the ability to move some numbers with any loyalty, it would be Thompson.

  27. GOPeach says:


    Oh Yes! I get Human Events newsletter and that came out today. I do not always agree with Ann. She is a little Presbyterian New Yorker….. A Baptist from Arkansas is a bit much for Ann, you know. 🙂

    I am neither a Baptist or a Presbyterian, but I do think there has been a wee too much persecution for our Brother Mike! All the bashing is making his base grow.

    You see… when Pat Robertson ran for Pres…. it was a JOKE!!! I always thought he was in way in way over his head. He had NEVER held a political office…..

    Then there was Ralph Reed…. he had never held an elected office either…. He would have been miserable as the Lt. Gov…. banging the gavel for 4 years and getting paid less than a manager at a Quick Trip.

    Now there is MIKE!!! He makes sense. He has the EXECUTIVE EXPERIENCE !!! Hello!!! That was the missing ingredient. 🙂

  28. BubbaRich says:

    Ann Coulter is so completely wrong on every scientific issue she babbles about, hearing she’s against Huckabee makes me feel better about ranking him fairly high on my personal candidate list.

    Jon and StillLooking:

    Paul is a lunatic. He showed very obviously that he has no economic plan. He says lots of words that can help get votes and contributions, like “END THE IRS!” but he doesn’t really have a plan but “we’d have to cut spending if we cut trillions of dollars of taxes”.

    His plans for “bringing all of our troops home” seems to show an ignorance of both defense and foreign policy that is appalling. Doesn’t he know that the host countries pay a good bit of upkeep on those troops, especially Japan? He seems to think we can eliminate virtually our entire standing military, which is an interesting idea, but nearly completely untried anywhere in the modern world.

    The transcript of his delusional outing on Meet the Press is here:

    He also seems to be delusional and coming close to bizarre other-worldliness with his comments about Israel and Iran. And his older comments about eliminating the CIA, FBI, public education, welfare, social security, and farm subsidies sounds like, along with eliminating a good bit of our military, that he wants to repeat the mistakes of the past. And he has no real plan for overcoming them, all based on some temporary working solutions that a bunch of decent men made in a world that was at least slightly different over two centuries ago.

    I apologize, this is supposed to be a thread about nearly former candidate Fred Thompson, but his failed candidacy isn’t nearly as interesting as Paul’s “Dennis Rodman” campaign.

    I liked Fred as a candidate, he was possibly in my top 5, although still waiting on more information about his actual positions on most issues. Which mostly puts him in the same category as Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, Mitt Romney, and most of the other leading candidates. Well, I know a lot of Romney’s statements about some of the issues, but I don’t know how to figure out which ones have changed since then.

  29. JonHodges says:

    Bubba Rich,
    Your facts are a mess. The federal income tax only amounts to about 30% of the federal budget. Or as the Gracie commission pointed out, just enough to pay the interest on the national debt. If you cut spending by about 30% you could eliminate the federal income tax. That is Paul’s economic plan, the other candidates actually think that tax money is paying for projects.
    Paul is not for ending public education, he is for eliminating useless federal government agencies like the Department of education. Federal involvement in education is unconstitutional, and unnecessary.
    As to his non-interventionism, that is simply the advice of our founding fathers. Our party is now the War party and it has never been that way until Bush. Repubs have always gotten us out of wars…You realize of course that the troops overwhelmingly support Dr. Paul, with their money. He has recieved more active duty, reservist and veteran campaign donations than any other candidate.
    As to your comment on Social security, you are wrong there as well, Paul wants the younger generation to have the option to opt out. He also wants to fully fund Social security, he would use some of the money we save in military intervention from the 130 countries around the world, to fund Social security, and Medicare. It is really not looney, you should go see why over 130,000 people gave to his campaign this quarter. http://www.ronpaul2008.com

  30. Still Looking says:

    JonH, Of course it would have better not to fight and lose 600,000 lives. Yet Paul is all backwards on his history. After Lincoln was elected, South Carolina and other states seceded from the Union and S.C. attacked Fort Sumter. Lincoln didn’t start the war, nor did he fight the war to end slavery. Lincoln fought to preserve the Union.

    Lincoln was very modest in his approach to slavery. He never campaigned to abolish it. He campiagned to prevent its spread into western states. BTW once into the war, Lincoln appropriately ended slavery. One-eighth of the American population were slaves. If he was going to fight a war that the south started, there weren’t going to be slaves afterwards. Emanicpation was a must.

    If Paul is such a patriot and lover of the Constitution, he should recognize Lincoln’s duty to preserve the Union and the Constitution.

    There are things I admire about Paul. He is refreshing in that he doesn’t buy all that right-wing crap about Islamofascisim and the War on Terror. He is ready to take a fresh look at things. Unfortunately Paul has not had any impact what so ever on the debate among GOP candidates. They all ignore him. And one of the reasons they can is that he says some patently absurd things.

    Paul put on the tin foil hat again when when it came to his discussion of the 1964 Civil Rights Act, which he said he would have voted against.

  31. GOPeach says:

    Mike Huckabee makes the most sense!

    He is enough anti-establishment to appeal to the Ron Paul voters. He is down to earth enough to appeal to mainstream America ( dems and republicans alike).

    I fell in love with Ron Paul when he stood down Rudy in the first debate. I remember how he squinted his eyes and spoke with such harnessed fire. WOW! Talk about hitting a nerve!!! Yeah Boy!!!

    Oh and I love the fact that he was an OB doctor who delivered over 4,000 babies.!!! Talk about Pro-Life!!!

    But then… I saw that Ron Paul lacked the Executive experience needed for the tough job that awaited him. I think Ron Paul’s heart is that of a revolutionary culture-shifting catalyst. Are you kidding me??? We will never be the same. He’s like a modern day Thomas Payne.

    I love Ron Paul enough not to vote for him. I want to protect him from a job that would cause him and his message to be diluted. He needs to travel the country giving lectures in colleges and keep the grass fire winds blowing for 2012! Then there will be a revolution!!!! It is a little early.

  32. GOPeach says:

    I would like to suggest that Freddy play the president on the new “24” series in January. That would be more fun for him… This president gig is … well….. pretty dull, don’t cha think??

  33. GOPeach says:

    I agree with Gov. Huckabee! We need to make the citizenship process better! Those who are in line need to become legal citizens ASAP!

    What is ” NON FISCAL” about that???? Pray Tell!

  34. Grits says:

    I had high hopes for Fred, but he has flopped. Mike Huckabee is a man of character who is well grounded and (as we all know) very articulate. Someone called him IRON JAW Mike the other day – I believe it fits him well. With all of the bad press he’s gotten, when he explains what really happend, he smells like a rose. I like Mike!

  35. debbie0040 says:

    Peach so you support granting amnesty and a path to citizenship to illegal aliens? That is what Huckabee advocated last year. The majority of Georgians disagree with you and so do I very strongly!! Huckabee’s poll numbers in Georgia will change once the ads start running about him supporting the amnesty bill..

  36. debbie0040 says:

    More from Thomas Sowell:
    The only candidate of either party who truly looks presidential is Mitt Romney. It was unfortunate that Mike Huckabee and others have tried to make his religion an issue.

    John F. Kennedy was supposed to have taken that issue out of politics

  37. debbie0040 says:

    I think if Huckabee is the nominee, you will see some fiscal conservatives either sit the election out or vote third party to make a point.

    All the major conservative commentators have bashed Huckabee; Noonan, Will, Sowell, Coulter, Limbaugh , in addition to Club For Growth, Cato Institute. 84 out of 85 anti illegal immigration groups have also bashed Huckabee.

    With all that, do you really think he has a prayer of winning? His record is being bought to light in Iowa and his poll numbers and approval ratings have begun trending downward. The same thing will happen in other states…

    When other candidates drop out, their supporters will flock to anyone except Huckabee…

  38. dcraigwhite says:


    Thankfully Mike Huckabee took his job as Governor serious enough to actually do what he said he would do in his oath of office. Sometimes, as a leader, your required to make tough decisions. As President, those decisions only get tougher. Mike Huckabee has shown that he has the ability to make those decisions. Is he right 100% of the time – absolutely not, but I challenge you to show me any man or woman who is. Virtually 90% of those who were granted parole by the parole board went on to live productive lives, not becoming repeat offenders.

    It continues to amaze me – for years Conservatives lambasted the MSM for being left-wing at best, the NYT being the bastion of this liberalism. Then, an article on Mike Huckabee comes out, and one statement, out of thousands of words becomes the headline. Rather than taking it with a grain of salt, as every story from the NYT should be be taken, it was assumed immediately that it was entirely accurate and that Mike Huckabee was attacking Romney’s faith. It’s convenient for you, and others, to take this story for more than what it actually is, because you’re not intellectually honest enough to check the facts for yourself. As a Huck supporter, I have no problem telling you which areas I disagree with him. I also have no problem telling you where I think he’s messed up. Until very recently, the second guy on my list was Mitt Romney, but he and his campaign has shown a complete disregard for the facts – much like you are doing in virtually every post on PP. Instead of continually bringing these lazy arguments, falling back on partisan pundits who’ve already picked their guy, why don’t you look into the circumstances surrounding all of these allegations? The people of Arkansas has no problem with their Governor doing his job. That’s why he was elected 4 times. They didn’t mind that their tax dollars made their roads better, or that their local school systems got more money, or that more business came to the state. See, when people can see the results of their tax dollars, the burden becomes diluted. Most people don’t mind paying for a better community. Not to mention he left the Governor’s office with a surplus in excess of 500 million. I don’t like his stance on tuition for illegal immigrants, but I feel confident that as President he’ll secure the border – as he’s laid out in his plan. I’m not sure how any U.S. Senator could be called an economic conservative after the spending adventures of the past 20 years, so to say that Fred Thompson is somehow more fiscally conservative than Mike Huckabee is unfounded. Secondly, your man Thompson has NO executive experience, and thus no one can say with any certainty that he is a strong fiscal conservative.

    Just food for thought…

  39. debbie0040 says:

    I have a news flash for you Drcraigwhite, it is not just the MSM that is attacking Huckabee. Conservative groups and conservative columnists are attacking Huckabee. Also former GOP elected officials in Arkansas. Bill Clinton kept getting re-elected as well. Does that mean he was a good Governor?

    Check out the fiscal conservative ratings at Club For Growth andsee how they rate Thompson and Tax Hike Mike.




    Former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee, suddenly a serious candidate for the Republican presidential nomination, is

  40. debbie0040 says:

    I have a news flash for you Drcraigwhite, it is not just the MSM that is attacking Huckabee. Conservative groups and conservative columnists are attacking Huckabee. Also former GOP elected officials in Arkansas. Bill Clinton kept getting re-elected as well. Does that mean he was a good Governor?

    Check out the fiscal conservative ratings at Club For Growth andsee how they rate Thompson and Tax Hike Mike.



  41. debbie0040 says:


    Poll: Voters still sampling candidates

    Dig beneath the surface of the raucous Republican presidential race and you will find even deeper turmoil: Four in 10 GOP voters have switched candidates in the past month alone, and nearly two-thirds say they may change their minds again.

    Mike Huckabee, who has roared to a tie with longtime front-runner Rudy Giuliani, has little reason to feel safe, according to an ongoing national survey conducted for The Associated Press and Yahoo News.

    Half of all voters

  42. whitemalevoters says:


    The type of poeple whose “1st Choice is Huckabee and 2nd Choice is Romney” are the type of people that make us worry about the future of our nation. How could someone be naive enough to be fooled by the two most obvious phonies in the entire race?

    It doesn’t take a keen intellect, that’s for sure.

  43. Jace Walden says:

    I’m still waiting for all of the Fredheads who have dismissed Ron Paul’s candidacy as “fringe” to be consistent and dismiss Fred’s candidacy as “fringe” since he is losing to Ron Paul in Iowa and New Hampshire!

  44. John Konop says:


    Are you making the racist black baby phone calls against Huckabee now or just McCain?

    WIKI- Reed is credited with orchestrating attacks on Senator John McCain in the 2000 South Carolina presidential primary, together with Roberta Combs, then head of the South Carolina Christian Coalition, who later took over the national Christian Coalition. Bush

  45. debbie0040 says:

    DRcraigwhite, show me where I posted something where I showed a complete disregard for the facts. It is you Huckabee supporters that ignore facts. You believe the dribble and spin from the Huckabee camp instead of checking the facts. Huckabee is not being attacked because he is a Christian, he is being attacked because of his record.

    He is not just being attacked by the MSM either.

  46. debbie0040 says:


    Election Study Finds Media Hit Hillary Hardest
    Obama, Huckabee Fare Best;

    FOX Is Most Balanced (not a typo)

    TV election news has been hardest on Hillary Clinton this fall, while Barack Obama and Mike Huckabee have been the biggest media favorites, according to a new study by the Center for Media and Public Affairs (CMPA) at George Mason University. The study also found that Fox NewsChannel?s evening news show provided more balanced coverage than its counterparts on the broadcast networks.

  47. SouthFultonGuy says:

    Ron Paul said the other day in an interview that Lincoln should not have fought the civil war, rather the United States should have bought the slaves from slave owners and freed them.

    Do you folks think this was a sound and viable option?

  48. cheapseats says:

    too funny!

    77 comments and counting – all arguing about which guy should be the losing candidate next November!

    Of course, 2/3 of the comments are from 2 people but…still, it’s entertaining.


  49. GOPeach says:


    Oh and about the the gifts that Gov. Huckabee received…

    These are things you learn as a pastor. GOD knows that most people want to keep pastors poor. I think it is a crime to not support our leaders be it civil or clergy. They lay down their lives for the sake of others.

    You should know! If you are a PK ( preacher’s kid) then you should know that pastors are not the rich people in town!!!

    I would love to know what elected leaders wanted at Target! It would be fun to buy them a gift that I know they actually want. That is a great idea. I wish I had thought of that. 🙂

  50. rugby_fan says:

    “Huckabee had the HEART of the American People.

    There is no stopping that you know.”

    The implication being that he has lost the heart of the people and there is no chance to regain it.

  51. Jace Walden says:

    It’s almost like asking if Ronald Reagan had not granted almost 2 million illegal aliens amensty, would we have such an illegal immigration problem today?

    It’s really easy to say “yes” or “no”, but its something that can’t be proven either way and is kind of foolish to waste time talking about.

  52. dcraigwhite says:


    You continually reference articles which, like Sowell’s article did, paint pictures which are not factual. Rather than relying on the pundits to select a candidate for you, why not do some independent research? I can find plenty of articles against ANY candidate – everyone has their opinion – but I’m not going to choose a candidate based on an article, I’m going to choose one based on fact. I only referenced the MSM because Sowell did in his article. You accuse huck supporters of “blindly following” but its you who simply takes the words of others rather than doing the research. Tell you what, just stick with your man fred and I’ll stick with huck. I’ll send you a postcard from the innauguration.

  53. GOPeach says:

    *Huckabee HAS the HEART if the AMERICAN people and will continue to gain more ground… one heart at a time!

    Most voters are not thinking as deep as Debbie. 🙂
    They have real human feelings and actually CARE about people…. That is HARD to BEAT!

    HEART-a- Beat Huckabee!

  54. debbie0040 says:

    Drcraig, I did do research on Huckabee . His record on illegal immigration and him being a fiscal liberal told me all I needed to know about Huckabee. The fact he thinks if he shouts Jesus loud enough it will obscure his record tells me what I need to know. Then there are his pardons and commutations of sentences of killers and rapists…

    I have opposed Huckabee long before these conservative leaders opposed him.

    I support Fred and anyone but Huckabee in the GOP Primary .

    Again I ask you, show one thing I have posted that is not correct. I am throwing the gauntlet down. Can’t wait to hear the spin…

  55. BubbaRich says:


    Lincoln’s only option was to surrender the country to splitting into (at first) two countries. You’d be living in the third-world country of Georgialina and hoping you’d get rich enough to be hired or enslaved by one of the wealthy Dukes of Haiti and Santo Domingo.

    Or maybe your family would have escaped to live in the British Empire (including Canada and New York) or the Soviet Union for a better way of life.

    You’d be better to ask whether the Virginians should have ever started that war with Great Britain, that caused tens of thousands of deaths, all over some political squabbles that were far smaller than anything squabbled over in the US Civil War.

    In more seriousness, Paul is completely insane and ignorant in his discussion of the Civil War and Lincoln. The Democratic Party split up in 1860 because Douglas wasn’t sufficiently strong in his desire to legally expand slavery for the southerners. The Democratic Party Convention that year fought between a group backing Douglas, and a group favoring secession from the US immediately. that is before Lincoln was elected, most likely before he was even nominated, although I don’t have time t0 check over the time line right now.

    The South did not permit discussion of ANY way to end slavery, and mostly found ways to outlaw even that discussion, like outlawing anything about freeing or educating slaves from the mail. they were upset (to the point of violence) by not extending slavery to the West, and even worse by not having complete control over their “property” when visiting a northern city. I’m nearly certain that buying the slaves back was proposed and rapidly destroyed as a potential idea, but I’ll have to dig through my books to find that if anybody still thinks Paul is sane or well-read.

    Paul’s economics is bad, his science is worse, and now his history is appallingly bad. It’s another thing that rednecks will find positive about him, though.

    You need to spend time sharing this type of information about real candidates. From what I’ve learned around here, Paul has gone from “might, might not” to “would vote against him if he were running for Macon city council.”

  56. BubbaRich says:

    Which assertions are you calling “wild” and “unprovable”? To make this easier for you, I’ll list the only assertions I see:

    1) Lincoln’s only options were Civil War or a divided country.

    2) A divided US would most likely be poorer than the current country.

    3) The Democratic Party split on the issue of slavery, between two DIFFERENT pro-slavery factions.

    4) The South suppressed any discussion of ending slavery, and indeed was loudly and violently for the expansion of slavery. “South” means, of course, slave owners and other white rednecks, since apparently nobody ever polled the slaves themselves. Polling them was bad, but raping them was fine, they were only property. (oops, jumped the tracks again. #4 is only the first sentence.)

    5. Ron Paul’s economics is bad, his science is worse, and his history is appalling.

    Now, Jace, I’m willing to dig up evidence to back up any of those. Or any other assertion you are willing to actually question. Now, tell me which thing you think is too crazy.

  57. NonPartisanGA says:

    Ron Paul stands no serious chance of winning the presidency, and that’s probably a good thing, but his candidacy serves as a reminder that the party of Goldwater still has a few honest libertarians in it.

  58. BubbaRich says:


    South Carolina had seceded before Lincoln took office. It then attacked the US base in the harbor. What option was there, again? Tell me you aren’t talking about the proposal to buy the slaves back. There were no other options at that time but war or surrender. You can argue about which of those would have been morally better, but we, today, are benefiting from the choice to re-unite the USA.

    I have read a substantial amount about Lincoln, although not the particular piece of Lost Cause propaganda that you mention. I see it’s quite popular on the web among a Certain Group of people, which means you can probably pick it up at gun shows with your confederate flag and lawn “darkie” and things like that. I’d suggest you get a few real biographies of Lincoln, he was really an amazing, decent human being, despite the fact that he kept the Union alive by temporarily damaging civil rights nearly as badly as Bush has.

    Slavery was not the issue that “led Lincoln to war,” it was the secession of several states even before he came to office, and the attack by one of them on a US military base. Lincoln did NOT want war over slavery, and he would not have pushed to remove slavery from the backwards, evil southern states, if they hadn’t declared war on the US.

    As far as economics, I’ve read Dr. Paul’s paper from the von Mises Institute about monetary theory, and it was clearly written by an OB/GYN. If somebody starts a thread about Paul’s economics, I might address it point by point, but it’s too long for this, especially when his historical errors are so obvious for laypeople.

    His willful scientific ignorance is one mark I hold against him pretty strongly, not that many politicians understand science very well anyway. But Paul has said some things that make him sound worse than Bush on science.

    Here’s another bit from, of all sources, wikipedia, that shows how much you and Dr. Paul are lying about Lincoln and the beginning of the US Civil War:

    By the time Lincoln took office, the Confederacy was an established fact, and no leaders of the insurrection proposed rejoining the Union on any terms. No compromise was found because a compromise was deemed virtually impossible. Lincoln might have allowed the southern states to secede, and some Republicans recommended that. However, conservative Democratic nationalists, such as Jeremiah S. Black, Joseph Holt, and Edwin M. Stanton had taken control of Buchanan’s cabinet around January 1, 1861, and refused to accept secession. Lincoln and nearly every Republican leader adopted this position by March 1861: the Union could not be dismantled. However, as a strict follower of the constitution, Lincoln refused to take any action against the South unless the Unionists themselves were attacked first. This finally happened in April 1861.

  59. BubbaRich says:

    I agree with Huckabee about the ongoing emergency law situation in Pakistan, even if Musharraf is refusing to use the term “martial law” any more. Anybody who attacks Huckabee on this particular choice of words is a loser who can’t be trusted.

  60. TPSoCal says:

    I have found my political soulmate. I agree with everything debbie0040 has said. She speaks truth to power. I have been disappointed as well by Thompson’s campaign, but he represents my views the closest. My second choice is McCain. I used to like Huckabee until I got to know him, he’s off the list. Romney is a GOP John Kerry. Rom Paul is fun, but I cannot support his view that everything is our fault and I support the war effort. Sticking our head in the sand is not a foreign policy, otherwise I LOVE everything else about him. Ron Paul would make a great Governor and I would support him 100%. Love Guliani, but way too much baggage.

  61. dcraigwhite says:


    You say huck is a fiscal liberal. Do fiscal liberals cut taxes, do they leave surpluses when handed deficits, do they balance budgets?

    You said huck was soft on illegal immigration. Are the softies proposing that we build a fence immediately, do they have 9 point plans on how best to solve the problem?

    You then made an absolutely stupid statement, concerning huck and “shouting Jesus” – grow up. God forbid a public figure invoke the name or person which influences him most.

    Then you throw in the “pardon” argument, which is clearly NOT researched on your behalf. There was a 90% success rate and he saved the taxpayers millions of dollars. Was he right 100% of the time-no-but who is debs? Atleast he took the job seriously enough to look at each case.

    There are some valid criticisms of huck, no doubt about it, but you have not raised any if them here. You make broad statements and cite no facts – just opinion.

  62. SouthFultonGuy says:

    Ron Paul advocates on CNN that we abandon Pakistan when asked about the Bhutto assassination. http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=332_1198801883

    If nothing else he’s doggedly consistent on ending all of our involvement outside our borders.

    I guess we don’t shoot until we see the whites of their eyes during the invasion or just put on our tinfoil hat when that nuke sails in.

  63. BubbaRich says:


    I’m not sure I’ve heard a smart and moral way to deal with Pakistan from any candidate or current officeholder. Bush’s current policy seems as reasonable as anything, although the way he and his supporters talk about it is a little disconcerting.

    Bill Richardson struck me as a guy who might have a smart policy, but his policy seems to be a Monty Pythonesque RUNAWAAAAY just like Ron Paul.

  64. GOPeach says:

    Mike Huckabee – A FISCAL CONSERVATIVE :

    # I support the FairTax.
    # As Governor of Arkansas, I cut taxes and fees almost 100 times, saving the taxpayers almost $380 million. I left a surplus of nearly $850 million, which I urged should go back to the people.
    # Our massive deficit is not due to Americans’ being under-taxed, but to the government’s over-spending.
    # To control spending, I believe the President should have the line-item veto.
    # I believe in free trade, but it has to be fair trade.
    # Globalization, done right, done fairly, can be the equivalent of a big pay raise by allowing us to buy things more cheaply.

  65. GOPeach says:

    A quote from Huckabee:

    “I’d like you to join me at the best “Going Out of Business” sale I can imagine – one held by the Internal Revenue Service. Am I running for president to shut down the federal government? Not exactly. But I am running to completely eliminate all federal income and payroll taxes. And I do mean all – personal federal, corporate federal, gift, estate, capital gains, alternative minimum, Social Security, Medicare, self-employment. All our hours filling out forms, all our payments for help with those forms, all our shopping bags filled with disorganized receipts, all our headaches and heartburn from tax stress will vanish. Instead we will have the FairTax, a simple tax based on wealth. When the FairTax becomes law, it will be like waving a magic wand releasing us from pain and unfairness.

    The FairTax will replace the Internal Revenue Code with a consumption tax, like the taxes on retail sales forty-five states and the District of Columbia have now. All of us will get a monthly rebate that will reimburse us for taxes on purchases up to the poverty line, so that we’re not taxed on necessities. That means people below the poverty line won’t be taxed at all. We’ll be taxed on what we decide to buy, not what we happen to earn. We won’t be taxed on what we choose to save or the interest those savings earn. The tax will apply only to new goods, so we can reduce our taxes further by buying a used car or computer.

    Our current progressive tax system penalizes us for working harder and becoming more successful. As we climb the ladder, the government lurks on each rung, hungry for a bigger bite out of our earnings. The FairTax is also progressive, but it doesn’t punish the American dream of success, or the old-fashioned virtues of hard work and thrift, it rewards and encourages them. The FairTax isn’t intended to raise any more or less money for the federal government to spend – it is revenue neutral.

    Expert analyses have shown that the FairTax lowers the lifetime tax burden of all of us: single or married; working or retired; rich, poor or middle class.

    The FairTax will instantly make American products 12 to 25% more competitive because the cost of those goods will no longer be inflated by corporate taxes, costs of tax compliance, and Social Security matching payments. When we buy products now, those taxes are built into the cost, so all of us pay corporate taxes indirectly on top of the personal taxes we pay directly. Compliance costs are just make-work with no real added value, yet they consume as much as 3% of our gross domestic product annually. These costs are an especially heavy burden on small businesses, which generate most of our jobs.

    If you buy a bottle of domestic wine, you’re paying the taxes/compliance/matching payments of all the folks who produced the grapes, the wine, the bottle, the cork, the label. If you buy a bottle of French wine, the producers had their Value Added Tax rebated to them when the wine was exported. So French consumers pay those taxes, but you don’t. Our current tax system puts our goods at a disadvantage both here and overseas. Other governments give their goods an advantage on the world market, an advantage estimated at 18% compared to American goods.

    So no matter how hard Americans work, no matter how innovative and creative we are, no matter how superior our products are, we suffer from a built-in competitive disadvantage simply because of our tax system. A recent study by MIT found that our tax system deprives us of about $1 billion in exports annually. When you export over-priced goods as we have, you inevitably end up exporting jobs and industries as we now are. We are the square peg trying to fit into the round hole of international trade. The rest of the world isn’t going to change, it’s time that we do.

    Under the FairTax, American companies are far less likely to move overseas and foreign companies are far more likely to come here, hiring Americans to build and work in their new plants. The FairTax encourages growth by promoting investment and capital formation.

    We have to scrap a 20th century tax system that is holding us back and keeping us down in the 21st century. The FairTax is the path to greater prosperity and job security for us and for our children.

    As Governor of Arkansas, I pushed through the Arkansas Legislature the first major, broad-based tax cuts in state history – a $90 million tax relief package for Arkansas families. I also doubled the standard deduction to $2,000 for single taxpayers and $4,000 for those who are married. Some taxes I eliminated entirely: the marriage penalty, bracket creep caused by inflation, income tax on poor families, and capital gains on home sales. To encourage investment, I cut capital gains for both individuals and businesses. To help people better themselves, I provided tax credits for employee training and education. In total, I cut taxes and fees nearly 100 times during my ten-and-a-half years as Governor, saving the people of Arkansas almost $380 million.

    When I left office in early 2007, Arkansas had nearly $850 million in state surplus, which I urged should go back to the people in the form of either a tax rebate or tax cut.

    I believe that our massive deficit is not due to Americans’ being under-taxed, but due to the federal government’s over-spending. Achieving and maintaining a balanced federal budget is an important and worthy goal necessary to our long-term economic well-being. To achieve a balanced federal budget, I believe the President should have the line-item veto.

    I believe in free trade, but it has to be fair trade. We are losing jobs because of an unlevel, unfair trading arena that has to be fixed. Behind the statistics, there are real families and real lives and real pain. I’m running for President because I don’t want people who have worked loyally for a company for twenty or thirty years to walk in one morning and be handed a pink slip and be told, “I’m sorry, but everything you spent your life working for is no longer here.”

    I believe that globalization, done right, done fairly, can be a blessing for our society. As the Industrial Revolution raised living standards by allowing ordinary people to buy mass-produced goods that previously only the rich could afford, so globalization gives all of us the equivalent of a big pay raise by letting us buy all kinds of things from clothing to computers to TVs much more inexpensively.”

    This is a bit more than shouting” Jesus”.

  66. GOPeach says:

    I know Huckabee is not perfect…

    But there are 2 candidates with executive experience – Romney and Huckabee –

    Which do you trust the most?????

  67. debbie0040 says:

    I turst Romney more than Hukcabee.

    Drcraig, I did research Huckabee. You have not repudiated any statement I made or story I posted.

    Are you denying Huckabee pardoned 1033 criminals more than the Governors of six states combined? When you say 90% success rate, what are you refering to? Tell that to the victims of Wayne Dumond.

    Fiscal liberals do end up with a net 500 million dollar tax increase as Huckabee did. Did you even bother to check out the facts presented by Cato Institute and Club For Growth?

    Huckabee had a road to DesMoines conversion as far as immigration and can not be trusted. His plan allows for amnesty . Why are 84 anti illegal immigration groups opposing him? They call him soft on immgration and say his current proposal is shamnesty. He supported the Whitehouse/Senate Amnesty Bill last year and advocated a path to citizenship for illegals. He called an Arkansas Senate bill that would require proof of citizenship in order to register to vote and that would deny state benefits to illegals un-Christian and un-American.

  68. debbie0040 says:

    Here is what Roy Beck with Numbers USA has to say about the GOP candidates and immigration:

    “Overall these are pretty disappointing. Now that Rep. Tom Tancredo has dropped out of the race, only two candidates (THOMPSON & HUNTER) are left who have vigorous and thorough enough opposition to amnesty to warrant an EXCELLENT rating.

    Ron Paul still gets a GOOD rating and could get an EXCELLENT if he would make clear how he plans to handle the illegal aliens here if they don’t get an amnesty. We don’t find a public commitment to Attrition Through Enforcement, although we feel he probably has it.

    Romney and Huckabee were earning themselves a GOOD rating just a couple of weeks ago. But both went on national TV and hemmed and hawed around amnesty questions, thoroughly confusing their message and raising grave doubts about their commitment to Attrition Through Enforcement as the solution for the 12-20 million illegal aliens now in our country. Both seemed defensive and more interested in being liked and thought politically correct by their media questioner than in making clear promises to the voters.

    You can read their muddled statements on their Candidate Page by clicking on their photo on The Grid. If these candidates truly understood the promises they have on their websites — and truly believed them — they would be able to confidently respond to media questions. At the most charitable, I would say Romney and Huckabee just haven’t spent enough time learning the issue.

    Top staffers of the Romney and Huckabee campaigns — like staffers of several others this month — have been in contact with us. They have promised us that their candidates simply misspoke on these recent network shows and can truly be counted on to stand against amnesties. The staffers made fairly persuasive cases. But their candidates — and their websites — have not themselves made new statements that offer that persuasive case to the public. So, the final word for now on their positions has to be found in what they told Tim Russert and Chris Wallace. Perhaps after Christmas.”

    Latest AMNESTY Ratings For Presidential Candidates (21DEC07)




    They are EXCELLENT in pledging through website and speech to oppose amnesties of all kinds for illegal aliens … advocating Attrition Through Enforcement to cause present 12-20 million illegals to go home over time



    Does a good job of opposing amnesties of all kinds for illegal aliens



    Does a fair job in pledging through website & speech to oppose amnesty … public statements create uncertainty about total opposition and about what eventually happens to the illegal aliens now here



    Does a poor job of pledging clear opposition to amnesty for illegal aliens … public statements sound like at least a portion will eventually get legalization




    While saying that enforcement measures must come first, they would allow most or large numbers of illegal aliens now here to remain and legalize their status









    They assertively advocate for the legalization of most or all illegal aliens now here … do not even require that tough enforcement measures against future illegal immigration be in place first


  69. debbie0040 says:


    Mike Huckabee last year accepted $52,000 in speaking fees from a bio-tech giant that wants to research human embryonic stem cells, a non-profit working to expand access to the morning after pill and a group pushing to study whether tightening gun control laws will reduce violence.

    Huckabee opposes embryonic stem cell research, emergency contraception and stricter gun laws

  70. Hey Debbie, I guess you learned to edit your copy and paste….

    Stem cells
    Stem cell research has raised hopes for a revolutionary treatment in the future with cell transplantation that can be offered to people with many different serious chronic diseases caused by degeneration of defined cell types, as, for example in the cases of diabetes and Parkinson’s disease.

    Novo Nordisk’s position
    Novo Nordisk wishes to pursue this very promising option for treatment. We want to be prepared for these new therapies and thus maintain a successful and sustainable business within diabetes care in the future. Novo Nordisk is – and has been for a long time

  71. debbie0040 says:

    Huckabee accepted money from a stem cell research company . He is supposed to be against it.

    Maurice, you have gotten pretty good at your copy and pastes and towing the line that comes out of the Huckabee camp to spin his record.

    Huckabee’s response to the Bhutto murder was to apologize. His campaign kept trying to explain what he meant. It turned into a laughingstock..

    These are perilious times and we don’t need a President that requires on the job training. We need a strong leader like Fred Thompson.


  72. dcraigwhite says:


    Let me get this straight…we should never parole ANY person who commits a crime, because there is a chance, however small, that they will become a repeat offender? Is this your logic? If so, you and Mitt would agree big time on this issue. Mitt Romney didn’t grant a single case, not even in the case of Anthony Circosta – look him up if you dare. Under your logic, no one would ever be up for early release, including patriots like this guy. Huck had 8700 requests for commutations while in office, and out of the 1300 he granted, only a handful returned to their sinister ways. Of course, it’s a horrible thing that happened with Dumond, but we have to believe that the rehab taking place in our prisons works. You are taking a horrible situation, and trying to turn it in to political gain, and it’s childish at best. When any program has a 90% success rate, it’s usually deemed “a success.”

    This is one example of you, showing no real knowledge of the subject, simply ranting away trying to demean Huck. In this case, as in some of the others, you show a complete disregard for the truth, and simply throw out generalities.

    I have no problem telling you that I don’t like a tax increase. I’ve never seen one I like, but I do understand that in Arkansas, from what I’ve heard and read, was in desperate need of rebuilding. From roads and highways to the local school systems, there was a great need in that state. When he became the Governor, there was a 200 million dollar deficit. Cutting spending was not enough. I wish it was. I wish the answer was always just to cut spending, but the problems presented by the crisis in Arkansas demanded more. Huckabee, after solving his state’s crisis, and rebuilding infrastructure like no governor before him, then lowered taxes and left a 850 million dollar surplus. Now for me, when I put this in perspective, it doesn’t add up to him being a fiscal liberal…I just don’t see it.

    You most recent post, concerning Huck speaking to groups with whom he disagrees, is absolutely moronic. Fred Thompson – your guy – used to lobby for a pro-abortion group. Apply your logic to that.

    Once again you’ve displayed that you’re doing nothing more than following the “talking points” of the day, sometimes even posting the articles themselves directly on this board. Oh yes, I’m so surprised that an article from National Review (which endorsed Romney) and Pat Toomey (who is obviously anti-Huck) is unfavorable towards Huck…sooo surprised. Come on Debbie, anyone can post an article against any one of the candidates.

    It’s my Christma-eh-New Years Eve wish that you would be intellectually honest enough to put things into context, and stop posting these straw man arguments, which could be applied to anyone including your candidate.

  73. debbie0040 says:

    Drcraigwhite, You are quite good at trying to spin Huckabee’s record on pardons and commutations. No, I don’t believe violent criminals showed be let out of prison early. Huckabee released more than the governors of six states combined. Huckabee showed a disregard for the victims families. Why don’t you do research and quit listening to the spin coming out of the Huckabee camp?



  74. GOPeach says:

    Debbie Debbie Debbie……

    When someone tells you that a loved one had died –
    you and I and EVERYONE ELSE USUALLY says….

    I AM SORRY!!!

    That could technically be an apology to hear of the news… that someone is having to weather such pain and grief…. etc…

    If you say that your mother died, I would say I am sorry…

    THAT does not mean I had ANYTHING To do with her death.

    This is such a blatant attack!!!! You have joined every hate-filled opponent in this election and your ruthless relentless malice is over the top!!!

    I seriously believe YOU have issues with ministers in politics. THAT is your problem. The media has been EXTRA HARSH to Huckabee because they are hell bent on the ” separation of Chrurch & State” mythology.

    I think you have something to prove. You want to make sure that NOBODY thinks you are a social conservative any more…. like they did in 2006…


    Nobody believes you are a social conservative anymore. We all know that you are a MODERATE!!!

    YOU have officially crossed over!!! We all recognize you as a fiscal conservative and a social moderate! Happy now????

  75. dcraigwhite says:

    How is it spin Debbie? It’s fact. Facts are he saw 8700 requests for commutations as Governor. Facts are he granted 1300 of them. Facts are about 90% of the 1300 went on to live quiet, productive lives. Where’s the spin?

    Under your logic Debs, we should first go ask the victims families whether or not they want the criminals to be released – WHAT? Get a life.

    And I can’t wait to hear how I’ve spun FDT’s record, I mean, how shameful to say he’s pro-life and then lobby on behalf of a pro-abortion group! SHAME SHAME SHAME! FDT is a con! FDT is a liar, he’s not trustworthy, blah, blah, blah – see how stupid that sounds…that’s exactly what you’re doing to Huck, and you look like a whimpering child – nothing more.

  76. debbie0040 says:

    Peach, If he were President, that would have a negative impact. You have be careful with your public statements. Huckabee realized he screwed up and tried to explain it.

    Peach, Drcraig, don’t you get it? It is not just a handful of people attacking Huckabee and it is not just MSM.

    You Hucksters would have us believe that conservative groups like Cato Institute, Club For Growth, Eagle Forum, 84 Anti Illegal immigrations group are all lying and Huckabee is telling the truth.

    You would have us believe that conservative leaders like Coulter, Rush, Noonan, Sowell, Will, Novak and others are all telling lies about Huckabee and he is the only one telling the truth.

    Yea, right. You need to pull your heads out of the sand…

    Peach, to paraphrase Clark Gable, frankly my dear I don’t give a damn ..what you think

    The media has not been harsh on Huckabee. Another falsehood coming from the Huckabee camp.


    Obama, Huckabee Fare Best;
    FOX Is Most Balanced (not a typo)

  77. debbie0040 says:

    The fact is Huckabee criticized Thompson for lobbying for an abortion rights firm when Huckabee accepted money from a company that was involved in stem cell research. Pretty hypocritical.

    I would strongly advise you read those links to get a clear picture of the commutations.

  78. GOPeach says:

    The Most Conservative is Ron Paul.

    The 2nd Most Conservative is Mike Huckabee.

    Because of the anit-war speech, Ron Paul will not get Mainstream votes.

    This is why we MUST BACK Huckabee.

    Ron Paul has become a Political Voice and his Truth is Marching On! I love what he has done and I know he will continue to be asked to speak for the rest of his life!

    Because of Ron Paul … we have all become more CONSTITUTIONAL!!!! We have had to STOP and THINK about the Law of the Land again.

    Ron Paul has met his objective. I love him.

    However, Mike Huckabee is the only candidate capable of getting mainstream voters and soft democrats to vote conservative. These are not just my thoughts, they are the thoughts of many others who are 50 + in age.

  79. dcraigwhite says:

    BS debs… You called out Huck, now I’m calling out your boy Fred. I don’t have a problem with Fred lobbying for anyone, I don’t have a problem with Huck speaking to anyone, but you do, you posted the article, so the burden is on you. You have a double standard, and YOU are the hypocritical one.

  80. debbie0040 says:

    Dcraig, Huckabee is the one that criticized Thompson a few months ago for lobbying for an abortion rights group and then we find out Huck accepted money from a company that does stem cell research. With Thompson it was part of his job, but not with Huckabee. Huckabee just wanted the money.

  81. GOPeach says:

    Jace –

    Your man RON PAUL is BOTH!!!!!

    He is the ONLY TRUE Conservative.

    FYI…. The GOP is nothing but Social Moderates now… people like Debbie!! She is right at home in the GOP.

  82. debbie0040 says:

    Jace, despite what Peach says I am a social conservative. I just believe the being a fiscal conservative is more important than being a social conservative.

    If I had to choose between a candidate that is a social conservative and one that is a fiscal conservative, I would choose fiscal.

    I have taken the political party test and scored between Libertarian and GOP.

  83. debbie0040 says:

    Peach, for the life of me, I can’t see how you support Ron Paul and Huckabee. They are nothing alike.

    Paul is a small government, fiscal conservative. He believes government is the problem not the solution. Huckabee is not like that.

  84. GOPeach says:

    Phyllis Schlafly called all top 5 candidates GLOBALISTS!!!

    She said,” all five leading candidates are globalists and none of them has a solution for the problem of millions of Americans who have lost jobs or had their wages depressed because of unfair trade agreements, outsourcing of jobs overseas, and insourcing foreign workers.”

    She is wrong.

    She is wrong that Huckabee want “unfair trade”…
    He is the ONLY CANDIDATE In the TOP 5 who said he is for FAIR TRADE…

    The sad thing is few people even know what THAT IS!!! I posted a great article about that so people could learn. I did not know what it was until it was explained to me.

  85. debbie0040 says:


    Phyllis Schlafly comments on Huckabee’s lack of conservatism

    Phyllis Schlafly, president of the national Eagle Forum, is even more blunt. “He [Huckabee] destroyed the conservative movement in Arkansas, and left the Republican Party a shambles,” she says. “Yet some of the same evangelicals who sold us on George W. Bush as a ‘compassionate conservative’ are now trying to sell us on Mike Huckabee.”

  86. GOPeach says:


    I am a CONSTITUTIONAL CONSERVATIVE. I have been around the language for a long time… I know it when I hear it —Congressman Paul Broun speaks this language.

    You said – “I can

  87. GOPeach says:

    Phylis says the same of ALL TOP 5 CANDIDATES DEBBIE!!

    You cut and paste. You make it like she is singling Huckabee out like YOU ARE DOING!!! She is not.

  88. Jace Walden says:

    Ron Paul is a great candidate. Admittedly, I don’t agree with everything he says. I believe in Free Trade, not Fair Trade. Paul’s stance on trade, however, has been mischaracterized. Paul is for free trade, but against government-controlled free trade agreements like NAFTA, CAFTA, and the WTO. And, to a certain extent, I agree with him. In order for trade between two individuals or groups to be completely “free”, the government doesn’t need to be involved in it. That said, NAFTA and CAFTA have had many positive effects for consumers, so as far as trade goes, Paul is letting perfect be the enemy of good.

    I could really care less about his comments on the civil war. His assertions, and the wild assertions of Bubba Rich, can neither be disproven or proven. Both arguments have merits and both have flaws. It’s pointless to focus on crap that happened 150 years ago.

    What’s important is the issues that affect us today. I’m not surprised that SouthFultonGuy could continue to spin Paul’s words on Pakistan as “abandonment”. At the same time, I could see how a logical person could come to that conclusion. The U.S. has been so deeply involved in foreign affairs the past 100 years that it is really hard for people to imagine what it would be like if we minded our own business and just focused on free trade and peace.

    I probably come off as a Ron Paul shill, and I’ve probably defended him over issues that I could care less about, but make no mistake I have reservations about him just like every other candidate. But he is, by far, the most fiscally conservative, pro-liberty, pro-peace candidate running from either party.

  89. GOPeach says:

    Huckabee Healthcare will beat Hillary-care-

    Look at this!!!

    # The health care system in this country is irrevocably broken, in part because it is only a “health care” system, not a “health” system.

    # We don’t need universal health care mandated by federal edict.

    # We do need to get serious about preventive health care.

    # I advocate policies that will encourage the private sector to seek innovative ways to bring down costs.

    # I value the states’ role as laboratories for new market-based approaches.

    # When I’m President, Americans will have more control of their health care options, not less.

    # As President, I will work with the private sector, Congress, health care providers, and other concerned parties to lead a complete overhaul of our health care system.

    # Our health care system is making our businesses non-competitive in the global economy. It is time to recognize that jobs don’t need health care, people do, and move from employer-based to consumer-based health care.

    HUCKABEE led the way in STATE HEALTHCARE in Arkansas – something the Clintons failed to do!!!!.

    ARKids First –


  90. dcraigwhite says:


    I like a lot of what Ron Paul says, a lot, but I find two major areas of concern. First, he said in an interview that “islamic terrorism, in and of itself, is not a threat to the United States.” Second, I have a hard time understanding how he can be anti-pork, but put millions of dollars in appropriations bills for what amounts to pork. I certainly agree with you that Paul is the most pro-liberty candidate, and probably the most pro-peace as well. Are those two things significant to you, and if so, what explanations have you heard that would counteract my concerns?


    No one mentioned anything about Fred until you pointed the finger at Huck. You didn’t say anything about it being a response, you simply posted the article in an attempt to further slander Huck. You’re willing to point the finger all day, but then you run away as quickly as possible when faced with the facts. You are the embodiment of a “homer”.


  91. GOPeach says:

    Huckabee the MODEL of Local State Control of Healthcare.

    ( I personally do not believe it is the STATE’S duty to provide healthcare – the dept. of H.E.W. is not in the CONSTITUTION)…

    It is not up to me to pay for my kids healthcare and your kids healthcare.

    Hillary’s book, ” It takes a Village to Raise a Child”…. came out of AFRICA!!!

    The last time I checked, Africa was pretty impoverished with the rich drug lords riding around with AKA’s firing off to blaring rap music .

    In a perfect world… RON PAUL would have the proper ideas. It’s just the Liberal Left has so brainwashed the ” Po Folks” to believe that people in the burbs are supposed to keep them up like some plantation master. This is why the tides turned to the CAPITALISTIC RIGHT! We got sick and tired of greasing everyone’s lazy palms…. Now we must stand!

  92. GOPeach says:

    Will Smith’s movie – ” Pursuit of Happyness” was such a great movie to show that ANYONE can have a piece of the action is you W O R K at it and never give up no matter how tired, hungry, shoeless, shirtless, tieless, carless, and homeless you are!!!

  93. debbie0040 says:

    Craig, I am not running anywhere. I will go toe to toe with you anyday of the week. You choose to ignore facts.

    I posted that article because it exposed Huck’s hypocrisy. You bought up Fred and I then mentioned the fact the Huckabee criticized Fred for lobbying for abortion rights group. I did bring this point up in another thread.

  94. Bill Simon says:

    Peach, the holiday of Christmas ALSO isn’t in “The Constitution,” yet it is a federally mandated holiday.

    You want to tear down all things “not in the Constitution”, make darn sure you go after all or none.

    Note: NOT that I am anti-Christmas…it is just that I believe in the concept of the consistency of logic.

  95. dcraigwhite says:

    But debbie, you didn’t mention ANYTHING in your post about Huck attacking Fred. You just typed a post that lambasted Huck for speaking to groups that he disagreed with. You claimed it was Huck who was “unprincipled” for speaking to these groups and getting paid. Which is stupid, because people with high profiles usually get paid to speak. Then, I countered with the fact that Thompson lobbied on behalf of a pro-choice group, and you then, instead of applying the same standards to Fred, turned it back on Huck. You said, “I did bring this point up in another thread.” So I am assuming that every thread is now required reading before posting on PP?

    Here’s where your facts are wrong – YOU DON’T GIVE FACTS, YOU GIVE OPINON.

    You only give generalities, like when you say, “Huck paroled 1300 criminals.” Put it in context. You choose only to look at the numbers you like, rather than the full story, because the full story actually makes sense, and wouldn’t support your moronic notions.

    Fred Thompson’s lobbying efforts led to over 10 million babies being aborted.

    That’s stupid. It’s not true, but that’s the kind of statements you’re making here, and it shows that you’re unwilling to see things with an opened mind. You have your mind made up, and anything that is remotely different MUST NOT be true. I don’t have any problems with Fred. I think he duped a lot of people (including some of my best friends and political mentors) into thinking he would be this incredible candidate, and that hasn’t materialized, but I don’t disagree with him on much. That said, I think anyone who looks at the situation with an open mind, and takes into account all of the facts, is likely to come to the conclusion I have. Like I’ve said, there are valid criticisms, but you continue to post the flimsiest of arguments.

  96. dcraigwhite says:


    I am interested in one of the statements in your post. And I don’t have a problem if you respond to this via email, as I don’t want to change the subject at hand, but, in your opinion, which things should we be dependent on the Federal Government to do? Is it idealistic to think that we should be strict constructionists, or is it practical? I’ve discussed this with my buddies at school and really sought to learn more about this in recent days, and would love to hear the opinions of others.

    Anyone with thoughts feel free to forward them to me. Thanks.

    [email protected]

  97. Jace Walden says:


    Honestly, “Islamic Terrorism” is something that I don’t agree with Paul 100% on…I do think that it is a threat, however I think the threat is greatly, greatly exaggerated. You have better odds of dying in many other uncontrollable ways than by being the victim of an Islamic terrorist attack. One think I do agree with Paul on though, is that the U.S. does have at least some responsibility for the spread of Islamic Terrorism due to our foreign policy. NO, I don’t think 9/11 was the “our fault” or anything like that. But it’s been a cause and effect relationship between our involvement in the mideast and the rise of Islamic terrorism.

    The two biggest concerns to me are:

    (1) Liberty, both Economic and Personal. Paul doesn’t have any interest in getting into someone’s wallet or their bedroom. None of the other candidates can say that.

    (2) Peace and Free Trade. I am a strong believer in a non-interventionalist foreign policy. I don’t think we should be policing any other country. We have far too many things to worry about at home. I also don’t believe in giving welfare to foreign countries any more than I do to our country.

    I’ll write more later, I have to leave for lunch.

    I agree with you about the pork issue. I think Paul is pretty hypocritical in that regard. As much as I rail on Porker-in-Chief Jack Kingston, I would be ideologically inconsistent to give Ron Paul a free pass.

  98. dcraigwhite says:


    I get what you’re saying, and I completely understand why you’d support Paul. I, like you, have never found a candidate with whom I agree 100% of the time, so when I find a guy who I agree with 90% of the time, I’ll be pretty comfortable supporting him. I’ve asked a couple of your fellow revolutionaries about those issues, and I haven’t gotten a straight response, so I appreciate your candor.

    Look forward to hearing more.

  99. GOPeach says:

    Dr. Craig-

    NOW you are getting down to where the rubber meets the road…. that is real traction.

    The #1 thing we should be dependent on the Federal Government to do is DEFENSE!!!!!

    We need to:

    2. WIN THE WAR

    These are key!

    The rest needs to be STATE governed.

  100. debbie0040 says:

    I posted facts not flimsy arguments. Huckabee is a spinmeister just like Clinton was and you are becoming one as well.. You ignore facts. I have given facts. I have supplied links . You ignore the facts because it is not what you want to hear.

    Did or did not Huckabee pardon or commute the sentences of murderers and rapists? Was Huckabee’s total more than the Governors of six states, including states with larger populations? I have watched videos of the victims families speaking out against Huckabee. I have read the news clippings. I don’t believe in commuting the sentences of violent criminals. Read the comparison between Huckabee and other Governors during the same time frame. Huckabee pardoned more criminals than Bill Clinton.

    Tell me Dcraig, are you a student at Liberty University?

  101. debbie0040 says:

    dcraig, did you even bother to read the information in those links? Did you even bother to check out Cato Institute and Club For Growth. They had facts…But then again they are facts you don’t want to hear so you ignore them or try to spin them.

  102. debbie0040 says:

    Huckabee has fooled a lot of people. I met Huckabee and was impressed with him. I believed he was genuine. Then I started hearing conservative icons like Phyllis Shafley saying pretty negative things about Huckabee so I started investigating him and came to the conclusion that he was a phoney and a RINO.

    I am a preachers kid so I don’t like it when someone uses religon to gain political traction as Huckabee does.

    I also don’t keep my head buried in the sand. I investigate things.

    Immigration and fiscal conservatism are bigger issues to me than abortion.

    I believe that powers not enumerated in the Constitution should be left up to the states to decide. IE:abortion, marriage

    You can not deny the facts on Huckabee’s record on immigration or taxes. Huckabee’s own words damn him as far as I am concerned.

  103. John Konop says:


    The issue is you have no credibility because you back candidates with similar flaws if not worse. You will say or do anything for your candidate like when the Reed crowd ( which you are part of) made the racist black baby calls against McCain.

    If I was part of the Fred Thompson team you would be a nightmare out of control. I may disagree at times with Jace but he has credibility via not being a hypocrite spewing hate like you do!

  104. dcraigwhite says:

    1. Yes, I am a student at Liberty.

    2. Yes, I checked out both of the sites you listed, long before you listed them.

    3. Yes, I hate that out of 1300 people, 10 or so ruined it for the rest. I hate that people were raped and killed.

    4. Yes, I do not consider articles written by those who have announced hostility towards Huck to be objective. While they may contain some facts, they tend to leave out the rest of the story.

    5. Yes, Huckabee’s total was more than the Governors of 6 larger states – explain to me why that matters?

    6. Yes, I feel for the families, but there is an obvious bias there. Come on, of course they are going to be ticked at Huck.

    7. Yes, every time I confront you with something you change the subject, never really answering any of my questions.

    8. No, I don’t make my decision based on what the think tanks say. I certainly take it into account, but no think-tank is an end-all for me.

    9. GOPeach, I appreciate the title, but I am not a Dr, however I don’t mind you calling me Dr. Craig…I kind of like it.

    10. Fred Thompson killed three dogs and committed the sin of gluttony 4 times last week on two separate occasions. Once he was caught he spent 5 minutes trying to explain to the 7 reporters present that it was really all about his 6 encounters with Ice-T on Law and Order: Criminal Intent.

  105. debbie0040 says:

    What questions have I not answered? You have not disputed any facts , you have just given your spin on it and tried to explain it

    5. It matters because it was out of proportion . The governors of six states combined did not see the need to commute as many sentences as Huckabee did.
    4. Which articles are you referring to? There is a reason they have hostility toward Huckabee. Former Republican elected officials in Arkansas have hostility against Huckabee as well. some links were newspaper stories that were written before Huckabee announce he was running for President.

    The reason I aksed about Liberty is if I am not mistaken, Dr. Falwell endorsed Huckabee.

  106. dcraigwhite says:

    If you’ll check, you’ll notice that the governors of those states did not even see as many requests at Huck did, so the comparison is a bit off base. Mitt Romney only received 272 requests, compared to Huck’s 8700, I’d say that’s quite a difference. Of course, the higher the number of requests, the higher the number of those released.

    Are you talking about the GOP politicians who Ron Paul’s campaign is paying $5000 to attack Huck?

    Dr. Falwell did endorse Huck, as did thousands of other students after hearing him speak. The on campus breakdown would be something like this: Huck – 60%, Mitt Romney and Ron Paul tied with 15% each, and the rest spilt.

  107. debbie0040 says:

    John, go back to licking your wounds over your humilating defeat by Price.

    I have posted facts not hate. You are the one has posted hate and attacks just because I don’t agree with you . You associate me with the South Carolina thing and McCain. I didn’t even know Ralph Reed then. But then facts don’t mean a thing to you. You are delusional …

    I would not want to be on the same team as you, make no mistake about that…

    I don’t like the fact I believe Huckabee uses his religion to try to get elected. At least either Giuliani and Romney are more of a fiscal conservative than Huckabee is. I like and respect Club for Growth and I value their opinion much more than I value yours..

  108. debbie0040 says:

    I have a problem with violent criminals having their commuted. It shows a lack of judgement. I don’t care how many requests he had. I now Huckabee did not have as many requests as the six states combined. The other Governors also did not release violent offenders as Huckabee did.

    Huckabee was also arrogant about the commutations when the victims families and district attorney’s started complaining about it. I suggest you are least read those articles in the Arkansas newspaper. And before you say it was written by the liberal press, the writer called Bill Clinton, a liar and sleezy in one of the articles.

    Another ridiculous accusation concerning Ron Paul. Why on earth would Ron Paul have to pay anyone to criticize Huckabee? The criticisms I am referring to happened while Huckabee was still Governor or Arkansas.

  109. GOPeach says:

    Debbie writes:

    “I believe that powers not enumerated in the Constitution should be left up to the states to decide. IE:abortion, marriage”…

    Well my dear –

    Your hard-earned money sent to the FEDERAL GOV. funds abortions INSTEAD of building BORDERS!!!

    If You were ANTI-FUNDING THE MURDERS OF AMERICAN CITIZENS in the womb … then and ONLY then would you a VOICE in Immigration.

  110. debbie0040 says:


    Iowa and New Hampshire Update

    Strategic Vision has released a new Iowa poll [pdf] that seems to show Fred Thompson is still maintaining his strong mid-teen level of support which is in direct conflict with the American Research Group poll that had him at 3% [pdf].

  111. Tommy_a2b says:

    Can this thread die please. Calling all people with posting privileges. Please post something interesting so we can change the subject. Isn’t there any info out of Iowa?

  112. GOPeach says:

    Huckabee does NOT use “his religion” to get elected. He has been labeled ” The Pastor/Governor” … so he is only being HIMSELF!

    He has the right to speak of his faith as much as ANY candidate!!! They are just gaged by PC bull crap. It is refreshing to hear someone not spineless.

    It sounds like you are jealous that Gov. Huckabee has been so successful in spite of much, much criticism.

    It also sounds like you are embarrassed that Gov. Huckabee is a Baptist – like you … and is catching some flack from ” icons” ….. pleeeeeeeeze. Icon???? Phyllis has criticized working mothers!!!!! She has criticized a lot of people !!!

  113. GOPeach says:


    Live blog in IOWA-

    Thursday, December 28, 2007

    Huckabee speaks to large “congregation” in WDM

    Huckabee got on stage at 1:39 p.m. The crowd stood to applaud his entrance. “You’d better be seated. You’d be tempted to leave,” Huckabee said, then he made reference to his introduction from a former southern state governor (not him). “Let’s pass the plates, man. This is like church,” Huckabee joked. .

    Huckabee then suggested a new Beattitude: “blessed are the brief, for they shall be invited again.” The crowd laughed.

    Huckabee reviewed the American Revolution, then moved on to talk about his Depression era parents. “My father never graduated high school,” Huckabee said. “…There was no male upstream from me…who had ever even graduated from high school….I am one generation away from dirt floors and outdoor toilets.”

    Huckabee then lauded his parents for their “patriotism.”

    “He laid on the stripes. I saw the stars,” Huckabee joked about the spankings administered by his father. The crowd laughed. “….It kept me straight.”

    Huckabee then talked briefly about the assassination of Benazir Bhutto, suggesting she represented a “threat” to radical Islamists. “Anyone who would put a bomb to the belly of his own child…would be more than willing to kill your child for his cause and so we live in a very dangerous world and the threats are many,” Huckabee said.

    “…Freedom is a gift, but like any gift it has to be protected, preserved….We can’t expect tha tthe politicians are always going to have our best interests in mind,” he said.

    Next, Huckabee talked to those disillusioned about politics. “There are many people who have given up….and I think a lot of people just get completely bummed out about the whole process.”

    (I think Huckabee is the only candidate I’ve heard today use the phrase “bummed out.”)

    Huckabee now moves into a discussion of the Iowa Caucuses, suggesting whomever wins will be “momentum” for “whatever happens” in other contests on the way to the GOP presidential nomination. “Quite frankly, the conventional wisdow is if you’ve got the most money, you’ll have teh most votes,” Huckabee said. If that is the case, Huckabee argued, then he had a suggestion for deciding who is the next president: “Instead of having voters, we ought to just put it up on EBay.”

    Huckabee, by the way, is roving the stage with the microphone, often casually leaning against the lectern.

    Standing in front of a huge placard with the phrase “We The People” written on it, Huckabee starts quoting from the Declaration of Independence.

    “It matters what we stand for. It matters what we believe,” Huckabee said.

    He’s now in the closing. “This is a great nation, but it’s only as great as those who live in it today are willing to make it for the next generation,” Huckabee said. “….Tonight we say we’ll be the somebodys. We’ll do something. We can change the world and the world starts right here, with me.”

    Speech over.

    Quite Honestly…

    Whatever happens with this race here in Iowa…irregardless of what you think of Huckabee or his policies…

    This man can deliver speeches.

    I’ve nearly been brought to tears time and time again by the guy.

  114. GOPeach says:

    TODAY IN IOWA … Dec. 28th 2007

    Another white blanket of snow spread across Iowa this morning, continuing what has been one of the wettest Decembers on record. National Weather Service meteorologist, Steve Teachout, says much of Iowa is getting measurable snowfall. Teachout says they’ve had reports of 2 to 4 inches from a Des Moines to Waterloo block, and north of the line from Perry to Ames, there’s an inch to a half inch of new snow. He says the snow should be easing up around noon in central Iowa, and later this afternoon as it moves out of eastern Iowa.

  115. Bill Simon says:


    Ignore Jace. Jace is basing his conclusions on pollsters who are basing their population samples on the wrong sampling technique.

    I would go over it here…but, that would tip-off the pollsters to re-engineer their sampling.

    And, I’d rather see the effect of what happens when the real results (i.e., the actual results at the conclusion of the caucus process in Iowa) are determined…and, some of the pollsters are exposed to be rather unreliable in their predictions. 🙂

  116. Bill Simon says:


    My point was not to “pick-on” the holiday of Christmas.

    It was more to the point that for every pet federal project that so-called conservatives want to eliminate, there is a pet project THEY have that is provided for by the federal government that they do not want to get rid of.

  117. GOPeach says:

    Huckabee calls for border crackdown in response to Bhutto’s assassination
    Thursday, December 27, 2007, 10:26 PM
    By O.Kay Henderson

    Republican presidential candidate Mike Huckabee says the assassination of Pakistani politician Benazir Bhutto underscores the need to secure the America’s borders to prevent potential terror attacks here.

    “We ought to have an immediate, very clear monitoring of our borders and particularly to make sure if there’s any unusal activity of Pakistanis coming into the country. We just need to be very, very thorough in looking at every aspect of our own security internally because, again, we live in a very, very dangerous time,” Huckabee said during a news conference Thursday night in West Des Moines.

    Huckabee called Bhutto’s death is a tragedy, but he suggested she had been a threat to Islamic fundamentalists. “An educated, sophisticated, strong, capable woman leader — that does pose a threat to those who don’t believe that women should be given that platform and that level of equality,” Huckabee said.

    Huckabee brushed aside the idea — posed by rival John McCain — that the incident highlights Huckabee’s lack of foreign policy credentials compared to McCain’s. “This is not a time for us to play political games with (Bhutto’s death). It’s a time to express our outrage as well as our sadness and sympathy for the people of Pakistan and for the rest of the world,” Huckabee told reporters.

    Huckabee also said it was time to put more pressure on Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf’s goernment. According to Huckabee, a “full accounting” of the $10 billion in U.S. aid sent to Pakistan since 9/11 is “more needful” now than ever.

  118. Bill Simon says:

    Thank you, Peach…for posting that.

    Huckabee is demonstrating how “populist” he is, but not demonstrating anything about his ability to articulate a clearly conservative position.

    If one has to resort to reaching for comparisons to explain a problem that has long existed, then that identifies THAT person as one who is incapable of articulating and defending their positions in the absence of outside (and, irrelevant) events.

  119. Bill Simon says:

    Dang, Jace

    You’re just a wee bit sensitive, ain’t ya?

    I will refrain from lowering my level of discourse with you down to YOUR level…although, I will admit…the temptation to b-slap you up and down this thread is quite strong. 🙂

  120. Bill Simon says:


    I must say, you DO express yourself in some very interesting ways. Did you major or minor in studying the defecation of different species at your institution of “higher learning?”

  121. Jace Walden says:

    Maybe I’m a little sensitive, but this is the 2nd time you’ve had some clever little remark regarding Fred’s polling status (while simultaneously taking a swipe at me) without backing any of your assertions up.

    I honestly do wish Fred was doing better. I really do. I wish Ron Paul was doing better. He’s my candidate. But at least I’m honest about his chances. Fred is tanking. It’s obvious. But I would gladly entertain evidence to the contrary.

    On a separate note, you probably could easily bitch slap me up and down this thread. I’ve only been blogging about 1/8 of the time you have, so I would have to yield to your superior intellect and prose.

    But…just because I’m in the mood for a good fight, why don’t you tell me why Fred is doing so great. Sound good?

  122. Bill Simon says:

    Regarding Fred…I’m just not in the mood to fight right now.

    (Note to all political historians: Mark this day as one day out of a few in which Bill Simon is not interested in fighting with anyone) 🙂

  123. John Konop says:


    You supported Ralph Reed after the racist attacks on John McCain. You made racist attacks on Obama. What does that say about you?

    As far as Tom Price, I have made it clear that he and I are close on healthcare. And I would help him in his effort to promote mandatory pay healthcare. Once again you are spewing hate just like a trained Ralph Reed soldier!

  124. dcraigwhite says:


    I wasn’t taking issue at all with the Christmas comment. I just posed the question to you, and other PP readers. I am trying to formulate my own views on what role the Constitution should play in governance. I would contend that it is, today, nothing more than a basis on which we govern. I would compare it to the role the 10 Commandments play in Christianity. What are the thoughts of PP readers on the Constitution? Is it realistic to hold everything up to the “Constitutional light” or should we be more pragmatic in our views?

    College student seeks opinions of others….


  125. Jace Walden says:


    As far as the Constitution goes, I don’t think there has ever been a time in American history in which a document calling for small government was more necessary than it is now.

    We need to go back to the Constitution 100%. Restore personal freedom, period. Reduce the size and scope of government by 50% or more.

  126. BubbaRich says:


    I already explained #1, and it really pains me to have to do even that to a purported history major. Lincoln came to office 3 months after the country was divided. The southern leaders would have accepted nothing but the legal expansion of slavery to come back into the US, as they had made quite clear over the years before the war. There was NO OPTION to “buy the slaves” from them. And they, finally, sealed the deal by attacking a US military base. There was no option other than either withdrawing from the base and letting the country remain divided, or fighting. You, of course, are welcome to present any evidence you have that supports Paul’s idea of an alternative that Lincoln had.

    That also shows #5, that Paul’s history is appalling. It’s interesting in another post that you said you “could really care less about his comments on the civil war.” Of course, that’s a common grammatical error you made, since it correctly should be “couldn’t care less,” but that’s a side note. It does, however, indicate that you don’t care what obviously ludicrous and false statements Paul makes about historical situations. To me, as a voter who tries to be informed, Paul’s fairly silly and at best uninformed ideas about history, economics, and science show a disregard for reality that I don’t want to put in charge of the country. Most of his supporters have a similar disconnection from reality, although more typically on the economics issue than on history or science.

    I don’t think it’s worthwhile to address #2 if you’re going to try to deny such obvious reality as #1, since it is less obvious and actually debatable.

    What was your area of concentration in history?

  127. TPSoCal says:

    I have a question:

    I can see the GOP is deeply divided this primary season. I can read a lot of animosity between fellow Republicans. My question is for my fellow Republicans: Is there any GOP candidate you dislike so much, that you would vote for the Democratic candidate in November?

    Me: I probably will support any GOP nominee over any Democratic candidate. Although I really don’t care for Huckabee.

  128. debbie0040 says:

    Jace, wasn’t it the America Research Poll that you referenced to Ron Paul being ahead of Fred? The poll below is the latest.

    debbie0040 // Dec 28, 2007 at 1:57 pm


    Iowa and New Hampshire Update

    Strategic Vision has released a new Iowa poll [pdf] that seems to show Fred Thompson is still maintaining his strong mid-teen level of support which is in direct conflict with the American Research Group poll that had him at 3% [pdf].

    John, I made no racist remarks about Obama. I was referring to Osama and put Obama by mistake, Anyone other than a moron can go back to the thread and see that. Anyone other than a moron,.. hmmm, maybe that explains why you can not see it…

    Club for Growth ratings:

    Rudy Giuliani Enacted Pro-Growth Policies Despite Liberal New York Environment


  129. Jace Walden says:

    If Strategic Vision’s polling methods are any good, then by all means, that’s great for Fred. I hope they are good. But every SV poll that I’ve seen has tended to “overvalue” Fred when compared to other polls taken around the same timeframe. Here’s hoping I’m wrong!

  130. BubbaRich says:

    I can’t disagree with that either, Jace, since I’m an Auburn Tiger AND a Yellow Jacket, and I understand you pledge some sort of allegiance to a mortal enemy of both.

  131. bowersville says:

    And you have the idiot Ron Paul blaming the United States for the events in Pakistan, and you have that nut Huckster staying at the Holiday Inn Express last night and making a joke of foreign events.

    I really don’t care if you are looking for a response from the Fredheads. What I’m looking for is for you RonPaulnuts to tell me that if we don’t vote for the blame America 1st idiot, you’re gonna vote Hillary. Or if we don’t support the Huckster, we don’t know Gawd.

    And oh yes, Mike Huckster, if you are reading this, Pakistan has at least 60 nuclear warheads. And RonPaul, America placed those warheads in Pakistan so that AQ could have justification for destroying us.

  132. debbie0040 says:

    Polls tend to be wrong and you can see the huge difference in the polls.

    Here is another poll that shows Fred with 1 %. Which poll is to be believed?


    Jace, in Iowa, you just never know what will happen. The link below has results from different polling data. It will be interesting to compare polls with the actual results… I know you really want to support Fred 🙂


    Huckabee’s response to the Bhutto assassination was an embarassment. He showed just how out of his league he is when it comes to foreign policy.


    In discussing the volatile situation in Pakistan, Mike Huckabee has made several erroneous or misleading statements at a time when he has been under increasing scrutiny from fellow presidential candidates for a lack of fluency in foreign policy issues.

  133. John Konop says:


    Did you not support Ralph Reed after his racist attacks on John McCain? This is the same strategy. McCain takes in a black child and claim the kid is his. You smear McCain to racist like yourself and at the same times accuse him of cheating on his wife.

    Why would any rational person not see you did the same thing with Obama? Debbie you are only fooling yourself. THE TRUTH WILL SET YOU FREE!

  134. debbie0040 says:

    John, I am going to ignore you from now. As far as I am concerned you are irrelevant. Keep on posting false information and accusations.


    Here is yet another Iowa poll by the Lee Enterprises. You may go ahead and compare all the polls for yourselves at our Iowa page.

    There is plenty of room for shifts in the final days before the Jan. 3 caucuses, with 19 percent of Democrats and 31 percent of Republicans saying they are likely or very likely to change their minds.

    Democratic Candidate IA
    Hillary Clinton 28%
    Barack Obama 29%
    John Edwards 29%
    Joe Biden 3%
    Bill Richardson 7%
    Chris Dodd 1%
    Dennis Kucinich 1%
    Other(vol.) 2%
    Details Link
    Sources Link

    The bottom line for Democrats is an already-close race is now closer.

    Republican Candidate IA
    Rudy Giuliani 8%
    John McCain 8%
    Fred Thompson 11%
    Mitt Romney 27%
    Mike Huckabee 34%
    Ron Paul 8%
    Duncan Hunter 1%
    Other(vol.) 3%
    Details Link
    Sources Link

  135. John Konop says:



    John, I am going to ignore you from now. As far as I am concerned you are irrelevant. Keep on posting false information and accusations.



  136. Icarus says:


    This thread is just plum full up with crazy.

    At the risk of pouring gas on the fire, I’m going to try and answer TPSoCal’s question. (Btw: Still hate Florida)

    I do not see a scenario where I could support Ron Paul. Would not vote for Hillary over him, but she (or any dem) would win the biggest landslide since Reagan v Mondale if he is our nominee.

    The reason: He takes enough rope to hang himself, without getting enough into his positions to articulate an actual plan of how to implement his ideas.

    He would not get the votes of the GWOT crowd. That’s probably at least 20-30% of the Republican Base. Hillary is arguably stronger on this issue than Paul.

    Then imagine the commercials and MSM going after him on his desire to eliminate medicare and social security. Dems trump this issue up against candidates when they just support slowing these programs’ growth. Imagine how they can villify a candidate who actually wants to eventually eliminate them.

    The problem isn’t so much that Paul’s ideas are wrong. He just has no practical solution to implement most of them, nor transition the millions of Americans who have grown dependent on these programs.

    The result of Paul being the nominee would be a voter backlash against the entire Republican ticket, giving the dems a fillabuster proof Senate and a huge lock on the House.

    Ron Paul has the role of Pat Buchanan from 1992. He will be the surrogate that shows dissatisfaction within the Republican base. He probably tops out at 20-25% of the R vote, but will stay in the race long enough to channel discontent within the Republicans.

    Whether or not he runs as a third party candidate is probably immaterial at this point. I think the Republican base is fractured to the point that no candiate in the race will rebuild the coalition necessary to defeat whatever Dem candidate who will offer free puppies to all Americans.

  137. TrueConservative says:

    I thought it was Sri Lanka? That same Ralph is spreading many lies about Huckabee for Romney, dispicable…

  138. debbie0040 says:

    TC, what lies are beind spread? The only lies I see being spread is Huckabee lying about his record and distorting it.

  139. debbie0040 says:


    Saturday, December 29, 2007

    The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Saturday shows five candidates within six percentage points of the lead in the race for the Republican Presidential Nomination. Not only are the top five candidates very close, 14% of voters remain undecided. With just days to go before the unpredictable Iowa caucuses, it

  140. StevePerkins says:

    Guys, stop posting to this thread for 24 hours. Take a breath, have a cool glass of ice water, go watch a movie or something. Then come back the next day and take a look at it with a fresh set of eyes.

    You’ll be ashamed of yourselves. 🙂

  141. JonHodges says:

    Your assertion is completely false. You along with the MSM continue to misrepresent Dr. Paul. He blames Americas Foreign Policy first, not America. There is a huge difference. He was exactly right about Pakistan, and he was right about Iran. The neconservative types like your beloved Hannity, or Bill O’reilly hate Dr. Paul, and have made it so that if you disagree with our foreign policy then you are not patriotic. Why do you think the military supports him overwhelmingly, but I guess you would call the military a bunch of crackpots, kooks and Paultard’s if you were being consistent.
    check out http://www.ronpaul2008.com/veterans

    $18.8 million raised so far this quarter, none of the other candidates come close. Huckabee tried a money bomb on the 27th, their goal was 1 Million, he actually raised about $80K, oh well can’t blame him for trying.

    Dr. Paul is going to shock the world on January 3rd. I guess at that point you will have to sign up for a mercenary outfit so you can go police Iraq.

  142. rugby_fan says:

    I’m going to say this, and I am not a Huckabee supporter.

    If Huckabee is the GOP nomination the Democrats are toast.

    Huckster has charm, you just can not beat charm. Kerry, arguably, acted more presidential in the 2004 race but Bush won because he was likable.

    In 92 Clinton won on charm.

    The ’80s were disasters for the Democrats by nominating candidates who were not personable in the least.

    Carter surprised people by winning with his folksy mannerisms and being friendly.

    I could go on and on but charm goes much further than policies ever could.

    The only way the Democrats could compete against Huckabee is if they nominate Obama. I am not an Obama fan either.

    Hillary is about as cold as they come. It would be easier for people to relate to Gore or Kerry than Hillary.

    Edwards might be able to win people over but I think his trial lawyer persona might show through too much.

  143. Rugby, I am amazed at this man’s ability. Six months ago I would have never given this man more than 4%.

    What I find completely interesting is that Romney (primarily) and the Club For Growth (which I normally appreciate) have attacked him on virtually every front. Its been overkill and the people see it. Romney’s public life is 1 term in any form of government. So there isn’t much to beat him with, other than the fact that he left Mass. in a financial hole.

    While in Connecticut, the folks I’m talking to are excited about Huckabee. I’m curious to see what happens in the coming weeks. It ought to be interesting.

    They like the fact that Huckabee relates extremely well. They’re also comfortable with the fact that he has a leadership track record. Its not mere rhetoric, its results.

  144. GOPeach says:

    Mike Hucakbee is smart, sincere, funny, calm, warm, steady, humble, focused, and able to connect with everyone.

    His will be the next president. I know it.

    Everyone come out to see him in ATLANTA at the GA RIGHT TO LIFE RALLY….. JAN 22!!!

    My whole family is planning to be there with friends from the Temple.

  145. Brian Laurens says:

    Hahaha, D. Texas Craig

    You have already been promoted to Dr. Or perhaps we should start calling you Pastor.

    T-4 days until Mitt or Huck is the nominee. Anyone wanna start placing bets on the primaries?

    Heres my predictions:

    Iowa- Romney
    New Hampshire- McCain
    Nevada- Romney
    South Carolina- Romney
    Florida- Huckabee

  146. SFrazier says:

    Romney needs professional help, the man does not know how to tell the truth, lies about everything. He has a real problem, and Americans do not want his problem….

  147. debbie0040 says:

    Hucakbee continues to misrepresent and spin his record.


    Huckabee’s Fiscal Record
    November 21, 2007
    Under fire from conservatives, the former Arkansas governor misrepresents his tax hikes, and cuts.

    Republican presidential candidate Mike Huckabee has been hit with criticism over his record on taxes as governor of Arkansas. The faultfinders have been members of his own party, who take issue with tax increases he enacted. In recent interviews on Fox News, Huckabee responded to some of these questions, but we found him to be misleading and incorrect on several points:

    Huckabee claimed that a speech in which he implored the state Legislature to raise taxes was in response to a state Supreme Court order to increase education funding. But he specifically said in that speech that he would address the education matter at a later date.
    He said a tax on beds filled in nursing homes was a “fee” not a tax, despite the fact that he himself has called it the “bed tax.”
    Huckabee claimed a gasoline tax was only passed after 80 percent of voters approved it. Not true. The tax was enacted before a referendum vote on highway repairs.
    He frequently says he cut taxes “almost 94 times” but leaves out the 21 taxes raised during his tenure. In the end, he presided over a net tax increase.
    Also, we find that former Tennessee Sen. Fred Thompson stretched the truth in claiming that Arkansas’ spending had doubled under Huckabee. It didn’t increase that much, and Huckabee left a sizable surplus. Analysis
    Former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee has drawn fire from fiscal conservatives who accuse him of pushing for tax increases. It’s an issue that has garnered plenty of back and forth in the blogosphere

  148. debbie0040 says:

    I support Fred but would much rather have either Rudy or Mitt win than Huckabee.

    Huckabee is losing ground when his true record is bought up.

    The Democrats will win easily if Huckabee is the nominee.

  149. SFrazier says:

    Debbie, I know a priest that has successfully performed an exorcism. If you would like to be set free of those demons plaguing you, I could speak to him?

  150. SFrazier says:

    I do like Rudy, and he was my second choice. But my priest let me know that he is in perpetual sin because of his refusal to change his view on abortion. As for Mitt, heck his Jesus got married and had kids according to his faith. That is not the Christian Jesus.. Off too the noon mass, where my priest and church is solidly behind the ” Huck”.

  151. debbie0040 says:

    Sfrazier, maybe you should call the Priest for yourself …

    I am suprised at the people that support Huckabee. I thought they opposed amnesty for illegals and were against illegal immigration. Obviously I was wrong because they support Huckabee and he advocates amnesty.

    An email I received:
    Friends of ALIPAC,

    Our team in Iowa has conducted over 25 talk radio interview broadcasts into Iowa and other locations around the nation. We have kept our message clear that Huckabee is trying to deceive the voters, is pro-amnesty, favors benefits for illegals, and that the endorsement of solo Minuteman Jim Gilchrist is opposed by our movement. Absolutely NO leaders have joined him in his support of the Huckster.

    Huckabee has Gilchrist on the media bus with him traveling across Iowa to try and deceive voters about his current and past stances on illegal immigration.

    ALIPAC has purchased a barrage of radio ads that will run on Tuesday and Wednesday, which will reinforce our message. We have targeted 43,000 likely Republican voter households with our message and received a 6 to 1 feedback in our favor.

    We have also launched an Internet effort where our core activists are on websites all across Iowa spreading the warnings about Gilchrist and Huckabee!

    Our ground team (Gheen, Gadiel, Smeriglio) has to fly out of Iowa today, after leaving friends and family behind on the holidays, however, the operations will continue until the votes are counted on Jan 3. Special thanks to Ernie of Techno Patriots who will be releasing video material from our trip soon.

    We have conducted a blogger interview with Ron Paul, but have been unable to gain interview access to Thompson and Romney. The Des Moines Register newspaper remains silent on our efforts at this time, but we have received national media coverage of the effort.

    We have made it very clear that ALIPAC is not endorsing a rival Presidential campaign. We have made it very clear that we are not receiving any financial support from any rival campaign and that our loyalties are to the public.

    Our strategy is to prove that our movement can cost a candidate a race. We are simply marking off the pro-amnesty candidates.

    The marked off list as of now are all Democrats, Guiliani, McCain, and Huckabee.

    Our supporters are free to do as they like, but we ask that the Romney, Thompsons, Paul, and Hunter supporters please consider calling off their attacks on each other until after January 3.

    Our efforts are having an impact. Huckabee’s numbers are dropping rapidly. We must prove that our collective efforts can expose a fraud and that being on the wrong side of this issue will cost a candidate their chances at winning.

    Those in our organization who are taking independent action to attack Paul or Romney should keep in mind that such actions will have a negative impact on our overall organizational strategy and that you could cost us access to the remaining campaigns we seek to interview and negotiate with.

    Our movement is unified against Huckabee and Gilchrist and we ask that everyone please keep your efforts focused there.

    It is unlikely you will see future operations such as this if January 3 shows that the combined and collective efforts of our movement cannot bring a candidate down from the lead.

    We have future plans to address the remaining four candidates and we have a plan to deal with a possible GOP primary win by a pro-amnesty candidate should we fail to secure an anti-amnesty candidate as a choice on the ballot from the GOP field.

    We will unveil new tactics and messages for Round 2 of our Iowa efforts Monday morning. The poll numbers show that Huckabee’s numbers have started to dive over the last 5 days.

    Let us all work together to keep our team focused on the mission. Let us all work together to make an example out of Huckabee on Jan 3.

  152. debbie0040 says:


    Sunday, December 30, 2007

    For the first time all year, Arizona Senator John McCain finds himself on top with support from 17% of Likely Republican Primary Voters. In the muddled GOP race, McCain becomes the third person to top the poll this month and the fourth since October. But his lead is statistically insignificant–Mitt Romney and Mike Huckabee are just a point behind at 16% and Rudy Giuliani is two points back at 15%. Slightly off the pace, but still within five points of McCain, is Fred Thompson at 12%. Ron Paul retains his base support at 7%.

  153. GOP Girl says:

    249 posts??? WTF people????


    I hope Fred crushes the pollsters. I’m not sure he will, but I HOPE he will.

  154. debbie0040 says:

    I disagree Maurice. I say the same thing about Huckabee. Huckabee has shown his lack of foreign policy understanding and experience this week. McCain has surged ahead because voters are thinking about foreign policy.. I can tell you that Romney has impressed me the past few weeks. Michael Savage even praised Romney’s response to the Bhutto killing. Romney is a fighter.

    Iowa is up for grabs. You just don’t know what will happen…

    I hope you are right Peach. I support Fred but have been disappointed in his campaigning style. Maybe he woke up before it is too late because he is giving it his all in Iowa now…

    Fred’s problem is his laid back campaign style. Voters expected to see Arthur Branch, the character Thompson played on Law and Order. They see Fred Thompson without the makeup and bright lights… Fred would make the best President by far if the voters just would realize that…

  155. Holly says:

    To answer the question about if there was an R I couldn’t vote for in the general, it’s Romney on my part. There are policy problems with almost all of the candidates, but he. . . actively creeps me out, and I’m convinced it’s the overly shiny teeth and Massachusetts politician’s dress code hairdo. It makes me not trust him on top of the fact he’s done some honest flip-flopping on issues. I guess that makes me shallow, but it underscores Rugby’s earlier point about charm and likeability.

    FWIW, I’m thinking more and more that we’re looking at Huckabee being the nominee.

  156. Romney’s biggest problem is Romney. His positions shift with each audience. He’s quick to hurl bricks at Huckabee’s 10 successful years leading Arkansas, but is defensive of his 4 year stint at leaving MA in a financial hole.

    He’s Pro-Life and Pro-Choice
    His father marched with MLK, but only in his mind (but this was really really important to the people).
    The man is a tremendous enterprising person. The former employees of SCM Paper Products really love him…. Not. This is one story you’ve never heard, but will at some point.
    Pro-Gay Romney Upsets Family Values Leader

    A prominent pro-family leader is urging fellow conservatives to withdraw their support for Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney over his recent expressed support for a

  157. ConservativeCaucus says:

    I agree Maurice. I think a Thompson ticket, a McCain ticket or a Huckabee ticket has a chance in November. If we nominate Giuliani or Romney, I believe we will go down in flames.

    As a Huckabee fan, I certainly have gotten nervous about Iowa… the polls have certainly gotten a lot closer. Unfortuately, negative politics works. That is why it is used. I hope that Romney hurts himself enough not to get the nomination – he is everything that is wrong with politics.

  158. BubbaRich says:

    I know some of y’all would enjoy frog marching the illegals out of the country, especially if you got to shoot them along the way, but that’s not going to be any part of an actual solution to the problem, and it’s just going to continue to get worse while you idjuts continue to insist on it as part of your “NO AMNESTY” screeching.

  159. debbie0040 says:

    Huckabee has misrepresented his record as well and is trying to spin his record. Huckabee supporters pointing their finger at Romney changing his stance is like the pot calling the kettle black.

    Romney has a better fiscal record than Huckabee and a much better record on immigration than Huckabee does.

    I would vote for any of the GOP candidates before I would vote for Huckabee.

  160. GOPeach says:

    Mormonism is a CULT!!!!

    I have not said very much about this but I am under conviction to WARN all CHRISTIANS to not be deceived.

    To elect a MORMON would advance MORMONISM in America.

  161. Icarus says:

    And I thought this thread had reached its crazy capacity two days and about 30 posts back. Silly little me for thinking such.

  162. GOPeach says:

    Here is what I say to my fellow Christians who are supporting Romney:

    Romney is an unashamed and proud member of the Mormon cult founded by a murdering polygamist pedophile named Joseph Smith nearly 200 years ago. The teachings of the Mormon cult are doctrinally and theologically in complete opposition to the Absolute Truth of God’s Word. There is no common ground. If Mormonism is true, then the Christian faith is a complete lie.

    Any Christian who supports Romney is choosing politics over CHRIST! It is THAT simple. Shame on you!!!!

  163. GOPeach says:


    Huckabee has not ran a NEGATIVE campaign because he not threatened. Romney has been more NEGATIVE than anyone…. he’s snaky.

    My thoughts from the SUGAR BOWL!!!!

  164. debbie0040 says:

    I would support Romney any day of the week over Huckabee. It is not negative to point out someone’s record. Huckabee kept touting his religion in hopes no one would pay attention to his record. I am not gullible. Huckabee can put a spin on things that would put Bill Clinton to shame.

    What Mormons believe about Jesus.


    Peach are you saying that you would not support someone that is Jewish, Catholic, or anyone that does not believe exactly as you do?Huckabee supporters attack Romney because of his religion. I don’t belive Romney has ever commuted the sentences of 1033 criminals, some murders and rapists.

    If not for Mike Huckabee, Lois Davidson would have celebrated Christmas with her daughter, Carol Sue. Hear Mrs. Davidson’s story here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFTdif_Lvsk

    Following your logic, Peach, Huckabee supporters are in favor of amnesty for illegal immigration, are complete imbeciles when it comes to foreign policy, favor releasing murderers and rapists from prison, favor raising taxes and big government, are ethically challenged, etc.

  165. BubbaRich says:

    Huckabee listened to other leaders in his Southern Baptist cult to first announcing plans to commute rapist Wayne DuMond’s sentence to time served, then he backed down and pressured the Arkansas parole board into releasing DuMond on parole. This was because the Baptist cult leaders were certain that the guy was in jail because his victim was a relative of Clinton. Huckabee said privately that he was unhappy with how Clinton handled the case so he planned to set DuMond free. The guy was quite obviously insane, and was even suspected of having castrated himself before his trial.

    Of course, everybody knows now that DuMond WAS actually an insane predator, and he raped and killed a couple of women after the Baptist ministers got their way and Huckabee helped release DuMond.

    Remember, everybody, this wasn’t an idiot move that Huckabee did on his own, releasing this obviously insane person, he was pressured by the entire conservative world, including a mass of his fellow Southern Baptist cult preachers, who apparently wanted to release this obviously insane rapist to get back at Clinton.

  166. ConservativeCaucus says:

    I agree with Debbie on the issue of pointing out someone’s record. I don’t like Romney’s ad and I do think they have been a little misleading, but the concept is not wrong. It is important to know someone’s record… that is a key part to deciding who to support.

    However, it is because of the combination of record, values, vision for the future, and ability to communicate that I am supporting Huckabee. Although at first glance the commutations record (not the fact that he denied any commutation for Wayne Dumond 4 times) is a concern, he did have 32 TIMES more requests than Romney did and Romney said no to every one. Does that make sense to anyone else? To me it looks like he was looking out for his own best interest, not the best interest of the citizens of Massachusetts.

    I would rather support someone who read every request for commutation thoroughly, read through their records and made a decision (that occasionally turned out to be a bad one) than someone who just said no to all of them regardless of the circumstances.

  167. BubbaRich says:


    That sounds reasonable to me, too. It’s very hard for supporters of the party to say that, though, since it clashes with the screaming about “NO AMNESTY” when anybody else proposes any realistic solution to the illegal immigration problem..

  168. CC, I agree as well. Context is everything. Huckabee has served more than 2 terms as governor, heck there would be enough issues for anyone to poke at, with any leader. In contrast, Romney has served 4 years in any elected capacity creating a much narrower issue base to attack. However, he’s given plenty of ammo if one chooses to pounce on it.

    On another thread, one of the posts indicated that religious right has worn out its usefulness and were no longer a factor in this election. WRONG.

    “””””The close race remains a challenge for Romney who enjoyed a healthy lead in Iowa for most of 2007. He was the only candidate to invest heavily in the state for much of the year and other leading candidates chose not to compete. The entire political world was stunned when Mike Huckabee surged to the lead in early December (Rasmussen Reports was the first poll to show Huckabee ahead).””””

    and, “”””The ultimate GOP winner in Iowa may be determined by something that polls can

  169. Ian says:

    Prices AFTER FairTax would look SIMILAR to prices BEFORE FairTax – NOT 30% HIGHER – as opponents contend; competition would see to it.

    The effective tax rate percentages, that different income groups would pay under a FairTax consumption tax, are calculated by crediting the monthly “prebate” (rebate of tax on necessities) against all likely monthly spending of citizen families (1 member, and greater based on figures established by the Dept. of Commerce – a single person receiving ~$200/mo. A family of four receiving ~$500, in addition to family earners receiving their WHOLE paycheck). Prof.’s Kotlikoff and Rapson (10/06) have concluded,

    (From study: http://snipurl.com/kotcomparetaxrates ) “…the FairTax imposes much lower average taxes on working-age households than does the current system. The FairTax broadens the tax base from what is now primarily a system of labor income taxation to a system that taxes, albeit indirectly, both labor income and existing wealth. By including existing wealth in the effective tax base, much of which is owned by rich and middle-class elderly households, the FairTax is able to tax labor income at a lower effective rate and, thereby, lower the average lifetime tax rates facing working-age Americans.

    “Consider, as an example, a single household age 30 earning $50,000. The household

  170. debbie0040 says:

    Nice attempt to spin Huckabee’s commuation record. His record was compared to the Governor’s of six surrounding states. Some states like Texas had a much larger population. Huckabee commuted or pardon more that the Governor’s of six states COMBINED!! Huckabee pardoned more than his three predessors combined, including Bill Clinton. Huckabee was also arrogant and not forth coming about the pardons as he was supposed to be with the district attorney’s and victims.

    He, at the very least, made serious errors in judgement. And you want this guy to have his finger on the nuclear trigger? You want this guy to deal with world leaders? You want this guy to face our enemies down?

  171. jsm says:

    I spent several hours with a friend of a friend on New Years Eve, who is a Ron Paul supporter. We had some friendly political discussion and managed to agree to disagree without any hard feelings.

    The main thing I noticed about this guy was that he seemed focused on various and sundry conspiracy theories. That struck a chord in my mind. How many Ron Paul people believe the US govt aided in the 9/11 tragedy, created the ‘character’ Osama bin Laden to use as a puppet, regularly rapes and pillages the homes of people who live around its overseas bases, and operates completely outside the direction of Congress and the President–using them only as a facade? There were other conspiracy theories he brought up that I had never even heard of. It was an interesting conversation, to say the least.

  172. debbie0040 says:

    JSM, I have had similar conversations with Paul supporters. I have also had many more with Paul supporters that are normal…

  173. debbie0040 says:

    This was sent to me in email and not it was not a Paul supporter. Very interesting..

    Huckabee Exposed as New World Order Puppet


    Huckabee Exposed as New World Order Puppet

    Mike Huckabee recently named Richard Haas (the President of the CFR) as his advisor on foreign policy. CNN’s WOLF BLITZER asked “Who are your principal foreign policy advisers, Governor?” Mike Huckabee responded: “Well, I have a number of people from whom I get policy. I’m talking to Frank Gaffney, I talk to Richard Haas..”

    So what does Richard Haas believe in? Here’s an article below which was written by Haas for the Tapei Times. It basically states the Bill of Rights and Constitution should be given up in favor of a cooperative world body run by elite consensus. Who needs individual rights in the techno-futuristic world police state? And you thought liberty was in jeopardy now? Just wait till you see what your children will have to deal with. Get activated folks, These police state freaks want to shape your future into a control grid enforced through the fear based reaction to state sponsored false flag terror.

  174. Doug Deal says:


    Don’t forget the conspiracy theory that the government is conspiring to take ever increasing amounts of money for wasteful government projects that do little more than buy votes.

    From my experience most Paul supports actually are more concerned with that one.

  175. rugby_fan says:


    The record is 554 comments. That thread was also the one where Cindye Coates asked GOPeach to stop campaigning for her.

    I am guessing if GOPeach over comes back from Bourbon Street she will help push us over the top.

Comments are closed.